Oct. 31, 2025

Hellraiser (1987)

Hellraiser (1987)

In this episode of the "All 80s Movies Podcast," hosts Bill Bant and Jason Masek delve into the 1987 horror classic 'Hellraiser,' directed by Clive Barker. They explore the film's unique blend of supernatural horror and psychological themes, focusing on the character dynamics, particularly between Frank Cotton and Julia. The hosts share their personal connections to the film, discuss its memorable special effects, and highlight their favorite scenes, including Frank's resurrection and Kirstie's encounter with the Cenobites. The conversation emphasizes the film's lasting impact and its exploration of obsession, pain, and pleasure. They discuss the film's low-budget production, the impact of Clive Barker's vision, and the various reactions of characters to the horrific events. The conversation also touches on logistical questions about the plot, the performances of the cast, and the film's legacy in the horror genre. Additionally, they share trivia, alternate titles, and their personal ratings of the film, highlighting its lasting influence and the complexities of its characters.

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Season 5 1987 Movies Horror

"Demon to some. Angel to others." We end "Splatter Cinema Month" with the supernatural horror movie 'Hellraiser.' The movie stars Andrew Robinson, Clare Higgins, Ashley Lawrence and Doug Bradley. Written and directed by Tom Holland.

Hellraiser - IMDB: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0093177/?ref_=nv_sr_srsg_1_tt_7_nm_0_in_0_q_hellraiser

Hellraiser - Rotten Tomatoes: https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/hellraiser

Bill's Letterboxd Ratings: https://letterboxd.com/bill_b/list/bills-all-80s-movies-podcast-ratings/

Jason's Letterboxd Ratings: https://letterboxd.com/jasonmasek/list/jasons-all-80s-movies-podcast-ratings/

Website: http://www.all80smoviespodcast.com

X (Twitter): https://twitter.com/podcastAll80s

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WEBVTT

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Hello, and welcome to the All Eighties Movies Podcast, the

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podcast where we talk about the blockbusters, stuff loops, and

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everything in between. One of the freshest decades for movies,

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the nineteen eighties. I'm your host Bill Bant Long with

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me on this journey revisiting eighties movies is by co

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host Jason Massek.

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Hello, Jason, I want to hear him confess himself. Then

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maybe maybe, But if you cheat us, we'll tear your

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soul apart.

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That's right, listeners, we're discussing with spoilers of plenty the

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nineteen eighty seven supernatural horror movie hell Raiser, who was

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produced by Film Futures and distributed by Entertainment Film distribut

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The movie stars Andrew Robinson, Claire Higgins, Ashley Lawrence, and

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Doug Bradley. Written directed by Clive Barker, this movie is

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rated R with the running time of one hour and

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thirty four minutes. It is based on Barker's nineteen eighty

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six novella The hell Bound Heart. So what is this

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movie about? What's on the box if you grew up

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in the nineteen eighties, and what's your local video store

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to rent this movie? You would find this description on

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the back of the VHS box. It is what's on

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the box. Take it away, Jason.

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From beyond the outer darkness, from the blackest corners of

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a family's past, from the nightmarish realm of the imagination,

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comes Hell Raiser. An old family home holds untold mysteries

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and horrors for Larry Cotton and his wife Julia. Floorboards

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that rattle, rooms that absorb blood, the heavy and haunting

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air of things long past and better left forgotten, all

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fueled by the fugitive spirit of Larry's brother Frank, who

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hovers halfway between this world and the next, between extreme

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pleasure and excres cruciating pain, and between family devotion and

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a deadly instinct for survival. Slowly, the old family home

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begins to swallow the Cottons, and there is no escape

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for Secret alliances and murderous deductions have been made which

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will propel the Cotton family into the horrifying and shocking

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conclusion of.

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Hell razor Hell Raiser. So that was what's on the box.

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Sorry to cut you off, I just wanted to have

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a little commentary on that. I thought that was a

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pretty awful synopsis, to be honest, makes it sound like

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this is a haunted house movie does and it really

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doesn't tap into the actual story whatever it might be.

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You know, it's it was a really weird one. Like,

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it sounds good, it's not poorly written, it's hard to read,

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but doesn't do this movie service. That's all I'm saying. Yeah, quick,

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what's on the box commentary?

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Let's move on to our eighty snapshot as we highlight

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some of the creative forces from this movie. Jason, who

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do you have?

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I have our writer director klaw Wife Barker Mister Barker

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was born in Liverpool, England. He is an English writer, director,

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and visual artists, best known for his works in the

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genres of horror and dark fantasy. In the early days

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of his artistic career, he supported himself by working as

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a male prostitute. In nineteen seventy eight, he co founded

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a theater group called The Dog Company, among whose members

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was Doug Bradley, who later went on to star in

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Barker's hell Raiser movie series. As we Know. He came

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to prominence in the nineteen eighties, this being Clyde Barker

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with a series of short stories collectively named The Books

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of Blood which established him as a leading horror author.

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So here's his eighties snapshot. In nineteen eighty five, he

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published his debut novel, The Damnation Game, and the same

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year he wrote his first feature movie scripts Underworld from

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nineteen eighty five and Rawhead Rex from nineteen eighty six.

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The end effect of these two movies disappointed Barker so

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much that he decided to adapt his prose into a

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movie he would direct himself, leading to the creation of

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hell Raiser in nineteen eighty seven, which is based on

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his novella, as Bill mentioned, The hell Bound Heart. Then

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he moves on to the sequel, hell Bound hell Raiser two,

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where he gets a based on a story by credit,

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And that's in nineteen eighty eight, and that's pretty much

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his eighties highlights. Of course, all the hell Raiser sequels

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that would follow, he would also get the quote unquote

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based on characters by credit. Moving on, in nineteen ninety

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he directs and writes the screenplay for one of my

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cult favorites, Night Breed, which was based on his novel Cabal.

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Then in ninety two, Candyman Comes Out, and that was

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based on The Forbidden which was one of the books

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of Blood short stories written by Barker. In ninety five,

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Lord of Illusions comes out, which he directed and wrote

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the screenplay for, and that was also based on one

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of his stories, The Last Illusion He Gets that based

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on characters by credit for some of the Candyman sequels.

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Beyond that, he's done some writing for various video games,

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TV episodes, and at one point he actually lost control

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of the Hell Raiser franchise, but regained it in twenty

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twenty and then there was a remake of Hell Razer

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in twenty twenty two, for which he has an executive

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producer credit. Clive Barker primarily known as an author for

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the Books of Blood short story series, also those works

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such as the Damnation game, We've World Cabal, the Hell

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Raiser series, Books of the Art series, and the Books

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of Abarat series. Clive Barker man of many talents.

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All Right, so I went with Ashley Lawrence. So. Ashley

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Lawrence is an American actress best known for her role

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as Kirsty Cotton in Hell Raser. She began her career

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on television with her curring role on the CBS soap

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opera Capitol. In guest appearances on shows like Highway to

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Heaven and Hunter. Her breakout role came with hell Raiser,

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a role she reprised in hell Bound hell Raser two,

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earning her a lasting play and horror history. Throughout the

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late eighties and nineties, Lawrence continued to take on genre roles,

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appearing in the horror anthology Monsters, the Lovecraft inspired Lurking Fear,

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and the supernatural thriller Warlock three The End of Innocence.

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She also took on dramatic and genre bending roles in

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projects like Er Hercules, The Legendary Journeys Beyond Belief, Fact

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or Fiction, and the indie film Lightning Bug. In addition

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to her live action work, Lawrence expanded into voice acting

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with her debut as Missy Carter in the atmospheric video

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game The Vanishing of Ethan Carter. She returned to voice

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work in twenty twenty for adult swims twisted animated comedy

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JJ Villard's Fairy Tales at California Native Ashley Lawrence continues

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to be a cult favorite in the horror community and

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a versatile painter and artist. So actress Ashley Lawrence.

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I'm glad you picked her, Bill Bantt, because she's good.

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She's good in this and I immediate is when you

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chose her? I had to go of course, and just

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doing general research look at her filmography and what and

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I'm glad she continues to work because I thought she

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was quick. Goodness.

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Yes, she's definitely highlighted this one. So this leads us

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to our earliest memories of the movie, Jason, why don't

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you start us off?

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Yeah? Absolutely. For me, the earliest memories are, well, my

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fascination with the mind and or worlds created by Clive

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Barker and this just strange, weird, wild darkness of the

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images provided by this film, Hell Raiser. I don't recall

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when or where with whom I saw this film, but

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I didn't see it in the theater, but it had

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some pull or allure for me, so I saw it

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on cable, probably a few years after it came out,

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so I know I saw it, but I couldn't recollect

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much of the story beats. All I could remember was

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the quote what's your pleasure, mister Cotton, and we'll tell

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your soul. The pollards, of course, the puzzle box itself.

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I remembered the lead Cenobite, which is just a character

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that's indelible, you can never forget. And he would, of

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course then in the sequels come to be known as Pinhead.

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That's the great Doug Bradley portraying the lead cenobite in this,

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and I mean his voice, his presence, all the paraphernalia

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in this. There's just the hooks, the chains, the bodies

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being tortured and torn apart. Those are early memories, just

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these images, right. I just recall that the tone of

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this was so different from other horror films of the time,

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this supernatural blend that was rooted in sato masochism and

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sex and torture, and this vision of hell or some

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sort of hellish in between underworld. I found it all

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very intriguing and disturbing. So it was the look, the field,

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the gore, the gross out factor and who is this

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Clive Barker guy that thought this up? This is just

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what grabbed me as a kid, I remember a teenager.

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After this. I would then watch hell Bound hell Raiser

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too often on cable. That was a big cable watch

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for me. I watched that repeatedly, and now I think

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back and I'm like, wait, did I see the sequel first?

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Before the original I would soon then thereafter become a

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fan of Night Breed, as I mentioned, and it's just

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these dark worlds or other worlds that Barker creates that

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contain these creatures of wonderfully disturbed designs, and I immediately

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want to know their origins and their backstories, and the

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worlds have such a visceral connection to a human's like

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base instincts of pain and pleasure and violence. I recall

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being at the library and finding a copy of Cabal,

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which Night Breed is based on, and reading some passages

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and just got a feel for Barker's writing, which is wonderful.

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I mentioned doing the same when we were doing our

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Dead Zone podcast with the Stephen King novel. I just

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had this morbid curiosity. These stories sparked my imagination because

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of that supernatural, fantastical aspect, but they made me feel

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something on a primal level. So this is just different

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from a Friday the thirteenth or typical eighty slasher that

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I was always too scared to watch, or a summer

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camp teen murder movie. This was just a different type

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of creative that appealed to me. That these ideas just

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had a certain type of ingenuity, and I'll never forget

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later on in the mid nineties reading Barker's The Thief

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of Always, which I think is from ninety two, which

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I still reference to this day, especially the holiday House

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aspect of that book and the character of Rictus. It's wild,

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creepy stuff and it feels original and it's very seductive

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in a strange way. And anyway, that's my memories of

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connection to the Clyde Barker universe in specific regard to

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hell Raiser. One other early memory connection to this Hell

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Raiser universe is that I was a fan of Christopher

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Young's score for hell Raiser two specifically, and used some

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of that for my um that is University in Miami

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Student film the Audition. Love me some Hell Raiser, great stuff.

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Those are some of my early memories. Bill Bant, what

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say you yeah? For me?

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I'm not sure if I saw these in order either,

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because I do remember seeing Hell Raiser available to rent,

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and I was just always passing that one because I'd

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find something else. And then I started watching them on

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late night cable, and I'll be honest, probably the one

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I would watch the most was hell Razer three, just

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because it had Terry Ferrell in it, and Paula Marshall,

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who had the hugest crush on and people are like,

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who the Hell's Paula Marshall. She really wasn't in a lot,

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but I was a big fan, so I think finally,

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when I was living in Florida and I was a

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member of the Dolphins, I had two roommates who happened

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to be Dolphins cheerleaders, so they knew I was the

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movie guy, and they're like, hey, Bill, go rent some

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horror movies. We'll do like a horror movie night. And

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I rented Hell Razer and Evil Dead, and according to them,

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I went over too. They didn't care for either, but

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I think I was arguing more with my roommates over

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Evil Dead. I was like, how can you not like

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Evil Dead? Then with Hell Razer they didn't like either

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of those. I think they wanted more jump scary stuff.

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That was really the first time I watched Hell Razor

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all the way from beginning to end. I think I

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was always watching bits and pieces, and I don't think

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I ever got beyond Hell Raiser three. And it was

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kind of funny because watching it for this episode, I

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was watching it on two b and then it would

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just jump into another film in the series, and I

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think I would watch like ten minutes and go yeah, no, thanks.

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So this is definitely the one of the ones that

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I did like that I've seen all the way through.

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That's great, So shout out to Laurie and Nicole.

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Good stuff, man, I that's funny that you chose those two.

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All right, let's get into initial thoughts. What are initial

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thoughts of Hell Raiser all this time later?

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Yeah, indeed, Well we get a nice running time here,

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Bill band of an hour and thirty three minutes. Not

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too bad.

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Best thing about horror movies.

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They're short and sweet, absolutely so no problem sitting through

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the opening credits of this one for me because of

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that score by Christopher Young. I love the music for this, agreed.

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It's haunting awesome. It is awesome, and it's got a

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triumphant sort of reoccurring theme loud horns and such and

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very big and bombastic. So and it captures that sort

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of fantastical quality of the well done Christopher Young and

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Bill Bann, I'm gonna want your thoughts on this because

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it's just a real interesting introduction of these characters in

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this film. We just really don't know anything about them.

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But the question is does it matter? So I'm going

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to go into this introduction here for those that either

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have or haven't seen this movie, or you haven't seen

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the movie in a long time. We only know and

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understand the relationships here in this beginning of the movie.

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So Frank Cotton, we see him in the beginning of

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this movie in some foreign country, at least it feels

248
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that way. We don't know where he is, but he's

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buying some sort of mysterious puzzle box and he seems

250
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actually somewhat desperate to have it. He pays a lot

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of money for it. We know nothing about who he is,

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or what he does, or where he's from. We just

253
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know here's a dude, he wants a box. Then all

254
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of a sudden cuts to him in a different room,

255
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which it feels like an attic or something with just

256
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floorboards and paneled walls, and he opens the box and

257
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the sparks fly. It's a puzzle box he manages to open,

258
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and that all of a sudden, these chains start flying

259
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out of the box with hooks on the end, and

260
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they come out and it pierced his skin and they're

261
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starting to tear them apart, and then it's another hard cut,

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basically to the house. I skipped one part with the

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centobites appearing, and they're putting Frank back together again. This

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moves very quickly in the beginning, and it cuts to

265
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then the house, which now we has no Frank in it,

266
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but we can see that he may have been squatting

267
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there for some time. And we were introduced to the

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characters of Larry and Julia Cotton, and they have now

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entered the house, and we learned that apparently this house

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belonged to Larry's mother, it was in their family, and

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now they're going to move into this house, but we

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don't know where it's located. I don't know bill is

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it in the suburbs of New York State. There's a

274
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mention of Brooklyn. Julia says, well, at least it's not Brooklyn.

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We don't know who these people are outside the fact

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that Larry says he's making a lot of money and

277
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supposedly this is Julia's old stomping ground or something there's

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an allusion to. But we know they're married and Julia

279
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isn't too keen on the condition of this house. They're

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about to move into. And then we get introduced to

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Christy played by Ashley Lawrence, who is Larry's daughter. She

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comes into town and she's rented a room. I don't

283
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know where this room is or whatnot, but it's nearby

284
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this house where we don't know where that is, and

285
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we know she doesn't want to stay at the house

286
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because she has some weird relationship with Julia. But anyway,

287
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we don't know where Christy came from, or where the

288
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room is she's staying in now, or where she's why

289
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she's decided to visit at this time. But she's in

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town to visit her dad, so is she there to

291
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help them move in or I don't know. We learn

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that Christy's birth mother actually had died, and obviously now

293
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we know that Larry remarried to Julia, So okay, maybe

294
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a bit of a difficult relationship between Christy and Julia.

295
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We get that. And now we find out that Frank,

296
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the guy with the box from the beginning, has been

297
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squatting in the house and that he's actually Larry's brother,

298
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And through flashbacks, we learned that Julia had an affair

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with Frank just before she wed Larry, and she had

300
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an intense sexual obsession with Frank. It was one that

301
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was filled with either S and M or some violent aspects,

302
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and Frank flamed out in this affair he was having

303
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with Julia before she married Larry, and Frank goes off

304
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in a pursuit to discover some further source of intense

305
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and heightened form of pleasure, which we can assume led

306
00:16:33.320 --> 00:16:35.600
him to hearing about the puzzle box. So that's it.

307
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We don't know anything about these people really at all.

308
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It's just wild shit starts to happen in this house

309
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and we kind of just have to go with it.

310
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We accept it. My question is then, to you, Bill,

311
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does that work for you? The way the beginning kind

312
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of just rolls along and these people show up. We

313
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understand their relationship to one another, but we don't know

314
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anything else about them at all.

315
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You know, it's funny. I was gonna mention that this time.

316
00:16:59.240 --> 00:17:02.279
I actually like that it does, and we need to

317
00:17:02.320 --> 00:17:05.960
find out, along with everybody else, what is going on.

318
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It's literally he gets a box the table. It's like

319
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a thirty second scene and then boom, next thing you know,

320
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he's on the floor in some room surrounded by candles,

321
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so you just go, okay, this is kind of a

322
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cult thing. He opens a box and he gets tripped apart,

323
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and you're like, whoa, what the hell's going on? And

324
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all these crazy creatures show up. Well, I guess we'll

325
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just figure this out as the movie goes along. And

326
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I was okay with it. Yeah, Yeah, And sometimes I

327
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would say, no, I don't like that. I don't know

328
00:17:35.839 --> 00:17:37.880
what the hell's going on, what any of this means.

329
00:17:37.960 --> 00:17:42.359
But for this movie, it did work for me, okay,

330
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because there is just so bizarre that I wanted to

331
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find out over the course of the movie. I don't

332
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think I want it spelled out for me from the beginning.

333
00:17:49.960 --> 00:17:52.279
Yeah, and I think it's a good writing lesson too.

334
00:17:52.279 --> 00:17:55.160
When you're watching it, we really don't need all that information,

335
00:17:55.200 --> 00:17:57.839
And we don't need to know what Larry Cotton's job

336
00:17:58.079 --> 00:18:01.559
is specifically, or what Julia's job is, or what there

337
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pass is, where did Frank come from, why did he

338
00:18:03.839 --> 00:18:06.039
end up in Morocco or China wherever he was to

339
00:18:06.079 --> 00:18:07.799
purchase the box. We don't need to know all that.

340
00:18:07.960 --> 00:18:10.160
We just need to know that it happened, and then

341
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we're on with our story.

342
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Yeah. I like that the Asia man didn't give him

343
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any kind of warning, just kind of that oh it

344
00:18:17.119 --> 00:18:20.319
was always yours right. Normally that would happen, you know,

345
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there'd be some kind of warning like are you sure

346
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you want to delve into this world? And nope, we

347
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don't get that. He gets the box and next thing

348
00:18:27.599 --> 00:18:29.319
you know, he's trying to open.

349
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It and all hell breaks loose. Cool cool, all right. Well,

350
00:18:33.480 --> 00:18:36.519
you know, I was thinking back to our previous horror film,

351
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Child's Play, and again with this one. For me, the

352
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star of the movie really is the makeup and costume

353
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design and a lot of the visual effects here. I

354
00:18:45.440 --> 00:18:47.359
know you'll have something to say about this, Bill Bant.

355
00:18:47.440 --> 00:18:50.400
The effects here are pretty awesome in spots. There are

356
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some weaker spots as well, where it looks a little cheaper,

357
00:18:55.079 --> 00:18:57.039
and we may get into the trivia as far as

358
00:18:57.359 --> 00:19:01.200
there were some budgetary restraints on this film, but overall,

359
00:19:01.759 --> 00:19:06.519
there's some crazy crasy effects and some disturbing costume designs,

360
00:19:06.519 --> 00:19:11.599
and it is very very sato masochistic. There's just a

361
00:19:11.599 --> 00:19:14.559
lot of close ups of hooks piercing the flesh. There's

362
00:19:14.880 --> 00:19:17.519
huge creature which we'd later find out in Trivia. I

363
00:19:17.559 --> 00:19:21.319
heard was called the Engineer that's chasing Christy down the hallway,

364
00:19:21.680 --> 00:19:23.920
which is a monster I felt wasn't even necessary in

365
00:19:23.920 --> 00:19:26.680
this film. I don't know, what did you think of

366
00:19:26.720 --> 00:19:29.720
the effects and the makeup and costume design of this

367
00:19:29.839 --> 00:19:30.640
crazy movie.

368
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I thought they were amazing. This movie and I'll get

369
00:19:34.640 --> 00:19:36.480
into it later, only had a budget of a million

370
00:19:36.519 --> 00:19:39.480
dollars and what they were able to put on screen.

371
00:19:39.839 --> 00:19:43.440
Granted its eighties million dollars might go a little bit

372
00:19:43.480 --> 00:19:47.160
further than today, but still what they were able to

373
00:19:47.200 --> 00:19:52.559
do was really impressive. Yeah, the Engineer was probably the

374
00:19:52.599 --> 00:19:58.119
weakest thing outside of when Kirsty banishes all the centabytes

375
00:19:58.160 --> 00:20:00.279
at the end. That's explained because they literally at that

376
00:20:00.359 --> 00:20:03.160
point had zero money and they were kind of doing

377
00:20:03.160 --> 00:20:03.920
that on their own.

378
00:20:04.519 --> 00:20:07.000
Yeah, there's, I mean, so much to talk about when

379
00:20:07.039 --> 00:20:08.680
it comes to the costumes. Eye I'm not going to

380
00:20:08.720 --> 00:20:10.759
get into it here. We will talk about it in

381
00:20:10.759 --> 00:20:15.720
Trivia somewhat. But the Cenobites themselves, they're costuming the where

382
00:20:15.880 --> 00:20:20.640
their look are extremely memorable. We've got Frank Cotton himself,

383
00:20:20.720 --> 00:20:23.200
which is he goes through quite a transformation, and I'm

384
00:20:23.240 --> 00:20:25.319
going to let Bill talk about that I'll talk about

385
00:20:25.319 --> 00:20:27.200
it a little bit too, probably in our favorite scenes.

386
00:20:27.640 --> 00:20:31.400
I think I'll step on my own complaint here. There

387
00:20:31.480 --> 00:20:34.759
was just sometimes when the hooks were they would do

388
00:20:34.799 --> 00:20:37.160
these close ups of the hooks piercing the flesh, like

389
00:20:37.200 --> 00:20:40.759
the cheeks and the body part that is clearly like latex.

390
00:20:40.839 --> 00:20:44.559
You could really see it didn't look like actual flesh.

391
00:20:44.839 --> 00:20:49.200
But I forgive that because of the budgetary restraints, but

392
00:20:49.319 --> 00:20:51.920
also because it's more of the idea it puts in

393
00:20:51.960 --> 00:20:55.359
your head because it just looks so awful. I mean,

394
00:20:55.400 --> 00:20:59.240
it's this body horror, it's this mutilation that's happening to

395
00:20:59.279 --> 00:21:02.960
these characters. Like that idea and that sort of that

396
00:21:03.039 --> 00:21:05.519
pain kind of grabs you in your mind, so you

397
00:21:05.599 --> 00:21:08.519
kind of gloss over the effect that the effect isn't

398
00:21:08.680 --> 00:21:13.920
totally effective. So moving along with more initial thoughts. Besides

399
00:21:14.000 --> 00:21:16.880
the standout of the effects and the makeup and costume design,

400
00:21:17.079 --> 00:21:19.799
I felt the actresses actually in this film where the

401
00:21:19.799 --> 00:21:22.519
standouts for me upon this rewatch as an adult. So

402
00:21:22.559 --> 00:21:26.000
shout out to both Claire Higgins, who portrays Julia Cotton,

403
00:21:26.160 --> 00:21:30.200
Larry's wife, and Ashley Lawrence who Bill mentioned, who plays

404
00:21:30.359 --> 00:21:34.279
Kirsty Cotton. It is Kirsty, not Christy, Kirsty Cotton. Claire

405
00:21:34.319 --> 00:21:37.319
Higgins as Julie, I thought she just really plays the

406
00:21:37.359 --> 00:21:41.640
sexuality and obsession with Frank Cotton extremely well. We have

407
00:21:41.680 --> 00:21:45.279
to believe she'll commit murder for this ghoulish character, and

408
00:21:45.559 --> 00:21:48.839
she does, although she is hesitant at first, but she

409
00:21:48.920 --> 00:21:52.160
plays the levels. I was only a little thrown off

410
00:21:52.400 --> 00:21:55.559
by her British accent, which seemed to kind of come

411
00:21:55.599 --> 00:21:58.400
and go, because there's a whole thing about that with

412
00:21:58.960 --> 00:22:02.880
using versus American actors in this film. But I thought

413
00:22:02.920 --> 00:22:06.599
she was quite good. I thought Ashley Lawrence really strong

414
00:22:07.119 --> 00:22:09.720
quote unquote final girl, if you will in this and

415
00:22:09.839 --> 00:22:12.680
I was yeah, like I said earlier, immediately asking did

416
00:22:12.720 --> 00:22:14.559
she go on to do anything else bigger and better?

417
00:22:14.599 --> 00:22:17.640
But she continually worked so good for Ashley Lawrence. The

418
00:22:17.720 --> 00:22:20.000
other actors in this bill banp for me were just fine.

419
00:22:20.039 --> 00:22:23.319
We have Andrew Robinson as Larry Cotton. He's pretty good.

420
00:22:23.359 --> 00:22:25.960
A shout out, of course, to Doug Bradley, who plays

421
00:22:25.960 --> 00:22:29.240
the iconic pinhead or he's only known as the lead

422
00:22:29.319 --> 00:22:33.519
Cenobite in this original film because Doug Bradley man, he's

423
00:22:33.559 --> 00:22:37.119
just got that low voice that dark, commanding, resounding quality,

424
00:22:37.240 --> 00:22:40.400
So he's impressive. Didn't know if you have any comments

425
00:22:40.400 --> 00:22:41.920
on the actors in this film.

426
00:22:42.079 --> 00:22:45.000
It's funny. My big complaint is Claire Higgins. I thought

427
00:22:45.000 --> 00:22:51.920
she was miscast. Really, yes, My issue was your point

428
00:22:52.319 --> 00:22:55.920
is right where you have to be convinced that she'll

429
00:22:55.920 --> 00:23:00.400
do this for Frank, and that part I do believe.

430
00:23:00.680 --> 00:23:04.759
But what I don't believe is that her and Larry

431
00:23:05.119 --> 00:23:07.640
would ever be a couple. To me, she seems like

432
00:23:07.720 --> 00:23:10.880
the poor woman's Meg Foster. I kept looking at her.

433
00:23:10.920 --> 00:23:12.799
I'm like, Wow, I'd rather have Meg Foster in this,

434
00:23:13.000 --> 00:23:15.160
because you know how much I not hate Meg Foster,

435
00:23:15.279 --> 00:23:17.359
but I hate the role she always plays because she

436
00:23:17.400 --> 00:23:19.640
always plays someone so mean. And I'm like, oh, she'd

437
00:23:19.640 --> 00:23:20.519
be perfect for this.

438
00:23:21.000 --> 00:23:23.240
That's a good call, and that's a great call. I

439
00:23:23.279 --> 00:23:24.000
hate to go.

440
00:23:24.279 --> 00:23:28.480
The looks were oute, but I didn't find clear that attractive.

441
00:23:28.839 --> 00:23:32.599
I understand why Frank would have an affair with Julia,

442
00:23:32.839 --> 00:23:35.680
because Frank would sleep with anything, didn't matter that he

443
00:23:35.839 --> 00:23:39.680
just had an obsession for that kind of behavior. But

444
00:23:40.279 --> 00:23:43.640
if I saw Julia sitting alone at a bar, I'm

445
00:23:43.640 --> 00:23:44.480
not going up to her.

446
00:23:45.279 --> 00:23:48.440
Okay, Hey, you're just being honest and she just doesn't

447
00:23:48.640 --> 00:23:52.039
specific taste. Okay, I found her. I'm on the opposite

448
00:23:52.079 --> 00:23:52.839
end with this.

449
00:23:53.200 --> 00:23:56.359
Yeah, and I just think she's so cold. I don't

450
00:23:56.480 --> 00:23:58.880
see what Larry sees in her at all. I don't

451
00:23:58.880 --> 00:24:01.960
see it. And I still understand how Larry so oblivious

452
00:24:02.000 --> 00:24:02.480
to it too.

453
00:24:02.839 --> 00:24:06.839
Hmm, Okay, fair enough, we accept your opinion here. Yeah,

454
00:24:06.839 --> 00:24:08.640
I'm on the opposite end. I thought thought it worked

455
00:24:08.640 --> 00:24:11.200
because she was so kind of cold toward Larry and

456
00:24:11.240 --> 00:24:13.400
the fact that then when you see the flashbacks with

457
00:24:13.599 --> 00:24:18.920
her and Frank, you see how completely taken she is

458
00:24:19.000 --> 00:24:23.039
with him being the sort of right sexually aggressive bad

459
00:24:23.079 --> 00:24:26.559
book don't get married. Yeah, they it's a good point.

460
00:24:26.920 --> 00:24:31.039
There's no she should definitely the married Frank's brother right

461
00:24:31.079 --> 00:24:37.079
after their affair. Yeah, okay, Well, moving along in regards

462
00:24:37.119 --> 00:24:40.960
to this budgetary restant, It's interesting that this film, which

463
00:24:41.039 --> 00:24:46.640
feels so huge on a fantastical level, the fantasy and

464
00:24:46.680 --> 00:24:50.440
the dark world aspect of it, the film's really contained.

465
00:24:50.759 --> 00:24:53.640
I mean, we barely go outside of the house, and

466
00:24:53.680 --> 00:24:56.680
when we do, it's really weird the choice of shots

467
00:24:56.680 --> 00:24:59.400
and sequences they choose to show us. But we barely

468
00:24:59.440 --> 00:25:02.519
go outside the house. There's really only two or three locations,

469
00:25:02.559 --> 00:25:04.279
like the hospital, the house.

470
00:25:04.440 --> 00:25:05.200
The pet store.

471
00:25:05.640 --> 00:25:08.119
The pet store. Right, But here's one thought I had,

472
00:25:08.119 --> 00:25:10.480
Bill ban. One would think that the hell Raiser House

473
00:25:10.599 --> 00:25:13.240
might have become iconic after this, but this it's not

474
00:25:13.279 --> 00:25:17.920
really known as one of those classic houses from horror movies,

475
00:25:18.480 --> 00:25:19.519
is it not?

476
00:25:19.880 --> 00:25:24.720
To my knowledge? But again, they shot this over seas, right,

477
00:25:24.839 --> 00:25:26.720
That was going to be in my next comment. Yeah,

478
00:25:26.759 --> 00:25:29.000
so maybe that's why we don't see a lot of

479
00:25:29.039 --> 00:25:31.440
people posting about it. I don't even know where they

480
00:25:31.799 --> 00:25:32.640
shot it.

481
00:25:32.720 --> 00:25:36.079
I didn't come across that either. It's in England though somewhere.

482
00:25:35.799 --> 00:25:37.640
Yeah, but I have no idea even what part.

483
00:25:38.079 --> 00:25:40.720
So that adds to the creepiness for me, Bill Bank,

484
00:25:40.960 --> 00:25:43.759
This film just feels strange overall. It's very off putting

485
00:25:43.759 --> 00:25:46.640
and upsetting, but in a good weird way for horror film,

486
00:25:46.759 --> 00:25:49.440
because there's just an overall strangers it just it doesn't

487
00:25:49.440 --> 00:25:52.079
have any big name actors in it. It's shot in England.

488
00:25:52.119 --> 00:25:55.200
It feels like a foreign horror film a little bit.

489
00:25:55.640 --> 00:25:58.119
And yeah, just kind of added into that whole creep

490
00:25:58.160 --> 00:26:00.319
factor for me, and even adding more and more to

491
00:26:00.319 --> 00:26:03.799
the creep factors that they wanted to have the actors

492
00:26:04.079 --> 00:26:07.400
be American for some reason, and so there's some really

493
00:26:07.440 --> 00:26:12.559
strange adr like overdubbing for Frank Cotton's character because it

494
00:26:12.599 --> 00:26:14.799
was an English actor. And I know I'm stepping on

495
00:26:14.880 --> 00:26:17.480
some trivia here, but that was just an initial thought.

496
00:26:17.480 --> 00:26:20.559
I'm watching this, this is weird. This one character is

497
00:26:20.759 --> 00:26:25.000
clearly being dubbed, and so when he was talking, that

498
00:26:25.160 --> 00:26:27.920
just threw me off. So this whole movie just gave

499
00:26:27.960 --> 00:26:31.160
me some creepy feelings. So I'll say right now, this

500
00:26:31.240 --> 00:26:33.839
film still works for me on that dark fantasy level.

501
00:26:33.839 --> 00:26:37.079
It still manages to creep into the dark corners of

502
00:26:37.119 --> 00:26:38.920
my mind and make me intrigue just to want to

503
00:26:38.960 --> 00:26:42.000
know what this world is, what the fuck is happening

504
00:26:42.039 --> 00:26:44.680
within it. But watching it as an adult, you can

505
00:26:44.759 --> 00:26:48.279
see some limitations because of the budget. But there's just

506
00:26:48.319 --> 00:26:51.000
a couple of sequences in here that are outstanding and

507
00:26:51.039 --> 00:26:53.079
you're like, how the hell did they do it? We'll

508
00:26:53.119 --> 00:26:55.440
get into it. I won't get into too much detail

509
00:26:55.519 --> 00:26:59.160
right now, but the design of the puzzle box itself

510
00:26:59.559 --> 00:27:02.079
the deeper I just want to go into this whole

511
00:27:02.079 --> 00:27:05.160
world and go into all the fandom wiki stuff and

512
00:27:05.240 --> 00:27:07.759
if you wanted to do a deep dive into the

513
00:27:08.079 --> 00:27:10.920
puzzle box, that's a lot of fun because that's got

514
00:27:10.920 --> 00:27:13.480
a whole history that they came up with a fiction

515
00:27:13.599 --> 00:27:16.599
behind it. I did have some issues with the fiction

516
00:27:16.720 --> 00:27:19.240
of this film story because it was the case of weight,

517
00:27:19.279 --> 00:27:21.920
did I miss something, there's some or there's some deleted

518
00:27:21.960 --> 00:27:24.200
scenes scenes. It was kind of the reminder we have

519
00:27:24.279 --> 00:27:26.200
Child's Play, which we just did Bill Bandt. There's some

520
00:27:26.279 --> 00:27:28.720
questions and holes in this and character choices that are

521
00:27:28.759 --> 00:27:31.279
confounding are questionable, and then we get to the end

522
00:27:31.319 --> 00:27:32.920
and the shit hits the fan, but it feels like

523
00:27:32.920 --> 00:27:35.160
it's just chaos for the sake of chaos, and that

524
00:27:35.200 --> 00:27:37.079
didn't quite work for me, and we'll talk about it.

525
00:27:37.599 --> 00:27:40.799
So it was a mixed bag for me on the

526
00:27:40.839 --> 00:27:44.960
first rewatch. However, ultimately, when I was watching it again

527
00:27:45.279 --> 00:27:48.240
to do notes and find our favorite scenes and moms,

528
00:27:48.640 --> 00:27:51.200
I come out in favor of this big time. It's imagination.

529
00:27:51.400 --> 00:27:54.119
It's singular, it's separate from the rest of the pack

530
00:27:54.200 --> 00:27:56.680
and the eighties horror films. For me, it may not

531
00:27:56.839 --> 00:28:00.400
hold together completely, but these ideas still get under my skin.

532
00:28:00.839 --> 00:28:04.160
I'm still captured by this concept. Those are just some

533
00:28:04.200 --> 00:28:06.039
of my initial thoughts. Did you want to add on

534
00:28:06.119 --> 00:28:08.119
to that, Yeah, if you have a.

535
00:28:08.079 --> 00:28:11.759
Weak stomach, I would not recommend Hell Razor if you've

536
00:28:11.759 --> 00:28:14.079
not seen it before. I don't know why. The first

537
00:28:14.079 --> 00:28:16.519
time I tried to watch it, I had made some nachos.

538
00:28:16.640 --> 00:28:18.319
I was like, Eh, this is not a good choice

539
00:28:18.359 --> 00:28:24.000
right now. But this movie is definitely gory. The special

540
00:28:24.000 --> 00:28:27.799
effects are impressive, and I agree with you to all

541
00:28:27.839 --> 00:28:30.720
the skin stuff. Yeah, that didn't work too great either.

542
00:28:31.359 --> 00:28:32.480
I like that it is.

543
00:28:32.480 --> 00:28:36.079
An original mythology, and you know, we meet all these

544
00:28:36.319 --> 00:28:43.400
Cinnabite characters and they're interdimensional beings obsessed with pain and pleasure,

545
00:28:44.079 --> 00:28:47.559
and you don't know where they're really from. Are they

546
00:28:47.720 --> 00:28:50.480
from one of the levels of hell? Where they come from?

547
00:28:50.519 --> 00:28:53.480
Are are they their own thing? I don't know. The

548
00:28:53.519 --> 00:28:57.680
Cinnabytes themselves are cool. You have Pinhead, the lead Lady Cinnabyte,

549
00:28:57.720 --> 00:29:01.680
the chatterbox guy, the bet Sky with the cool glasses,

550
00:29:01.960 --> 00:29:06.079
butter Ball. Yes. I was really a fan of Ashley

551
00:29:06.160 --> 00:29:08.759
Lawrence in this. I feel like she does kind of

552
00:29:08.799 --> 00:29:12.519
ground the film. She is the one character to me

553
00:29:12.640 --> 00:29:16.200
that that really works, and because of her, that's why

554
00:29:16.440 --> 00:29:19.920
I enjoyed the movie. There's just a lot of weird stuff.

555
00:29:20.240 --> 00:29:22.519
There's just so many things about this that are different

556
00:29:22.559 --> 00:29:26.039
from typical horror movies that we cover. It's usually just

557
00:29:26.079 --> 00:29:29.279
hack and slash, and this really gets into the exploration

558
00:29:29.559 --> 00:29:35.160
of obsession, the power of compulsion, temptation, what the cost

559
00:29:35.279 --> 00:29:40.079
is of seeking a forbidden experience. And I found this

560
00:29:40.119 --> 00:29:43.319
one line that I thought was great. It goes curiosity

561
00:29:43.400 --> 00:29:47.599
doesn't always lead to answers, Sometimes it opens doors. You

562
00:29:47.680 --> 00:29:52.400
can't close this this movie to a t right. It's

563
00:29:52.599 --> 00:29:56.079
definitely something unique and the fact that it just kind

564
00:29:56.119 --> 00:29:59.480
of scratches to the surface of the mythology makes you

565
00:29:59.559 --> 00:30:02.680
want to know more. And unfortunately, I know the other

566
00:30:02.759 --> 00:30:06.720
movies went in such weird directions that didn't capture what

567
00:30:06.920 --> 00:30:11.319
this base. The foundation that this movie sets, you were

568
00:30:11.359 --> 00:30:14.880
to only to watch this one and know of none

569
00:30:14.920 --> 00:30:17.759
of the others. I think it does what it needs

570
00:30:17.799 --> 00:30:21.160
to do overall as a horror movie. Mm hm, So

571
00:30:21.279 --> 00:30:23.880
that's my initial thoughts. All right, let's get in two

572
00:30:24.240 --> 00:30:26.400
favorite scenes or moments. What are some of our favorite

573
00:30:26.400 --> 00:30:27.799
scenes of moments from Hell Raiser.

574
00:30:28.400 --> 00:30:30.480
Let's talk about it, Bill Bandon, I should tell our

575
00:30:30.480 --> 00:30:33.039
audience I've wanted to do this film for a long time.

576
00:30:33.119 --> 00:30:35.039
I think I've always brought it up on our lists

577
00:30:35.039 --> 00:30:37.440
when we're figuring out our schedules. So I thank you

578
00:30:37.519 --> 00:30:40.039
Bill for coming around too. And it's not that you

579
00:30:40.079 --> 00:30:42.839
didn't want to do this, but I'm glad we are

580
00:30:43.160 --> 00:30:47.920
finally doing it. I finally relent it because I have

581
00:30:48.039 --> 00:30:52.440
my own obsession with this film. But yeah, it's interesting

582
00:30:52.440 --> 00:30:55.480
because I was just thinking upon our initial thoughts combined,

583
00:30:55.920 --> 00:30:58.400
and I'm glad you brought up the Centabites a little bit,

584
00:30:58.400 --> 00:31:00.799
because if there's people listening to this I haven't seen

585
00:31:00.839 --> 00:31:03.680
this film for any reason, they'd be like, I still

586
00:31:03.720 --> 00:31:05.599
have no idea what this movie is about. What are

587
00:31:05.599 --> 00:31:08.359
they talking about? There's no concrete foundation, like real thing

588
00:31:08.400 --> 00:31:10.759
to hold on to. What are cenobites? What is this

589
00:31:10.839 --> 00:31:13.920
puzzle box? What is happening in this movie? Well we'll

590
00:31:13.920 --> 00:31:15.880
get into it a little bit here with our favorite

591
00:31:15.880 --> 00:31:19.559
scenes and moments, But my first favorite scene is the

592
00:31:19.680 --> 00:31:23.839
reincarnation of Frank Cotton, or in the research, I believe

593
00:31:23.839 --> 00:31:27.720
they call it the birthing scene. So up to this point,

594
00:31:27.759 --> 00:31:30.400
we do know that Frank Cotton went to a foreign

595
00:31:30.400 --> 00:31:34.480
country to seek the ultimate forms of pleasure and in

596
00:31:34.519 --> 00:31:37.519
any way he could find it, and somehow his search

597
00:31:37.680 --> 00:31:41.920
or research led him to this merchant who sold him

598
00:31:42.119 --> 00:31:45.240
this puzzle box. So when we see in the open

599
00:31:45.279 --> 00:31:47.920
that Frank Cotton plays with this puzzle box a little

600
00:31:47.920 --> 00:31:52.160
bit manages to open it and unleashes an basically other

601
00:31:52.400 --> 00:31:56.039
world which could be described as hell. We're not sure,

602
00:31:56.240 --> 00:31:59.720
but what has happened is he had gone to his

603
00:31:59.759 --> 00:32:01.839
home or I should say his mother's home where he

604
00:32:01.880 --> 00:32:05.319
was squatting, went into a room, opened the box and

605
00:32:05.680 --> 00:32:09.920
opened up this whole other world of sato masochistic pain

606
00:32:09.960 --> 00:32:13.880
and pleasure, and he gets torn apart literally And what

607
00:32:14.039 --> 00:32:19.359
ends up happening is that his guts are actually basically

608
00:32:19.440 --> 00:32:25.319
attached underneath the floorboards of this room because when his

609
00:32:25.519 --> 00:32:30.799
destruction occurred, one of the cenobytes that had appeared and

610
00:32:30.839 --> 00:32:32.799
we do get to see the cenobytes near the beginning

611
00:32:32.799 --> 00:32:34.880
of the film. They don't speak, but we have the

612
00:32:34.960 --> 00:32:38.240
lead cenobite, we have the female cetabite, we have the chatterer,

613
00:32:38.279 --> 00:32:42.160
and we have Butterball. And these are four very specific looking,

614
00:32:42.240 --> 00:32:47.039
crazy looking cenobites that are basically the protectors or guardians

615
00:32:47.079 --> 00:32:51.720
of this realm, and they enforce this pain and pleasure

616
00:32:51.799 --> 00:32:55.039
upon the victims that decide to enter this world. And

617
00:32:55.759 --> 00:32:59.519
they are putting together the pieces of Frank Cotton after

618
00:32:59.559 --> 00:33:02.720
they just him, and we see the lead cenobite put

619
00:33:02.759 --> 00:33:05.759
the puzzle box like back together, and then all of

620
00:33:05.799 --> 00:33:10.279
a sudden, this otherworldly, hellish landscape disappears, and now the

621
00:33:10.359 --> 00:33:13.400
room which Frank Cotton was in in his mother's house

622
00:33:13.759 --> 00:33:17.279
returns to normal, is just a bare room. It's completely empty.

623
00:33:17.960 --> 00:33:22.559
Now cut to Larry Cotton, Frank's brother, and Larry's wife,

624
00:33:22.720 --> 00:33:26.559
Julia Cotton, are going to move into this house. And

625
00:33:26.599 --> 00:33:30.599
when they're moving in, Larry manages to cut his hand

626
00:33:30.720 --> 00:33:33.720
on a rusty nail that's protruding from a column somewhere,

627
00:33:34.160 --> 00:33:38.319
and he goes up to Julia into this room where

628
00:33:38.599 --> 00:33:42.079
Frank had performed as ritual with the box previous, and

629
00:33:42.599 --> 00:33:46.839
he shows his hand to Julia, and at this point

630
00:33:47.000 --> 00:33:50.079
Julia is just standing there and it's like, I'll help you,

631
00:33:50.480 --> 00:33:52.960
which she does, but it doesn't prevent the fact that

632
00:33:53.200 --> 00:33:57.079
his blood is dripping all over these floorboards in this room.

633
00:33:57.480 --> 00:34:02.440
And after Larry and Julia exit, we see that the

634
00:34:02.480 --> 00:34:07.480
floorboards in this room start to absorb the blood, and

635
00:34:07.680 --> 00:34:10.679
the camera lores beneath the floorboards and we see what

636
00:34:10.719 --> 00:34:13.360
we can assume are again these literal guts of Frank

637
00:34:13.440 --> 00:34:16.639
sticking to the boards underneath. And when these guts, particularly

638
00:34:16.639 --> 00:34:19.239
that the heart I assume is what we're looking at,

639
00:34:19.559 --> 00:34:24.639
absorbs this blood from Larry, it begins to inflate and deflate. Now, meanwhile,

640
00:34:24.960 --> 00:34:29.239
Larry's daughter Kirsty played by Ashley Lawrence, takes her dad

641
00:34:29.280 --> 00:34:31.440
to the hospital for stitches in his hand that he

642
00:34:31.840 --> 00:34:34.800
tore apart with that nail. And it cuts back to

643
00:34:34.960 --> 00:34:38.440
this what I'm just calling the hell room. And now

644
00:34:38.519 --> 00:34:42.800
the floorboards are starting to shake. Bubbles of goo are forming,

645
00:34:43.400 --> 00:34:49.000
and suddenly two separate bones shoot upward through this goo,

646
00:34:49.119 --> 00:34:52.880
through the floorboards, and we soon see that they are arms.

647
00:34:52.920 --> 00:34:55.679
They're arms of a bone, and they bend at the elbows,

648
00:34:55.679 --> 00:34:58.920
and what we're watching is a human skeletal form emerging

649
00:34:59.079 --> 00:35:03.400
from the floor. This is an insane sequence. The effects

650
00:35:03.400 --> 00:35:06.280
in the makeup are wonderful. We see the formation of

651
00:35:06.320 --> 00:35:11.360
this person's hands. There's some flesh forming, it's blood mixed

652
00:35:11.360 --> 00:35:15.280
with the goo. We see a human brain taking formation,

653
00:35:15.760 --> 00:35:18.920
the brain stem connects to the brain. It's all intercut

654
00:35:18.920 --> 00:35:21.840
with these rats up in this room, cowering and climbing

655
00:35:21.920 --> 00:35:24.960
over one another, and we finally see this human skeleton

656
00:35:25.519 --> 00:35:30.360
covered in goo push itself upward and it emits this

657
00:35:30.480 --> 00:35:34.400
horrible scream, And because we know what had happened previous,

658
00:35:34.400 --> 00:35:37.400
we can assume that this is Frank Cotton's body coming

659
00:35:37.480 --> 00:35:41.920
back to life. And this all happens backed by the

660
00:35:41.960 --> 00:35:45.440
great score of Christopher Young. The music is outstanding as

661
00:35:45.480 --> 00:35:47.679
this is happening, and it's not a long sequence, and

662
00:35:47.719 --> 00:35:50.639
I've watched it several times now. It's like watching a

663
00:35:50.679 --> 00:35:52.760
train wreck. You can't keep your eyes off of it

664
00:35:52.880 --> 00:35:55.119
because of how it's shot. A lot of it and

665
00:35:55.159 --> 00:35:57.679
I won't step on too much trivia here, but how

666
00:35:57.719 --> 00:36:00.320
this particular skeleton, in the flesh and the goo we'll

667
00:36:00.400 --> 00:36:05.199
come together literally out of the floor, is pretty wild.

668
00:36:05.519 --> 00:36:08.159
What do you think about this whole sequence? Bill Oh?

669
00:36:08.159 --> 00:36:10.280
I had this down as one of my favorites also,

670
00:36:10.639 --> 00:36:15.280
and I like how it's set up where Larry cuts

671
00:36:15.360 --> 00:36:19.519
himself and he's screamings about blood, so of course he's

672
00:36:19.519 --> 00:36:21.679
got to find Julia and he's bleeding out and dripping

673
00:36:21.679 --> 00:36:25.320
all over the floor and they're inner cutting with the

674
00:36:25.360 --> 00:36:29.880
blood literally being seaked into the wood m h. And

675
00:36:29.920 --> 00:36:31.639
then all of a sudden, like you said, the scoo

676
00:36:31.760 --> 00:36:35.679
starts pulling out and you're like, what the hell is

677
00:36:35.719 --> 00:36:37.519
going on? And it takes a while for you to

678
00:36:37.519 --> 00:36:41.360
figure out, Oh, this is Frank being brought back from

679
00:36:41.440 --> 00:36:45.840
wherever he was right and watching it some of the stuff,

680
00:36:45.840 --> 00:36:47.920
I could figure out how they could do it, you know,

681
00:36:47.960 --> 00:36:50.519
some of it has stopped motion, some of it's puppetry,

682
00:36:50.679 --> 00:36:52.400
but there is a couple of those shots. I'm like,

683
00:36:52.519 --> 00:36:56.239
I don't know how they figured this out with eighties

684
00:36:56.800 --> 00:36:59.599
special effects. It's a wild sequence. You can't keep your

685
00:36:59.599 --> 00:37:01.400
eyes off that. If you're a horror fan, you just

686
00:37:01.480 --> 00:37:03.840
keep watching over and over because I'm like, all right,

687
00:37:03.920 --> 00:37:07.119
how did they do this? It's really disgusting. I need

688
00:37:07.159 --> 00:37:11.880
to put my nachos down and just see what happens next.

689
00:37:12.519 --> 00:37:15.800
Yeah, it'll turn your stomach for sure. It made me

690
00:37:15.880 --> 00:37:20.599
think of the wonderful transformation sequence from American were Wolf

691
00:37:20.639 --> 00:37:23.239
in London, because that's just one of the classic all

692
00:37:23.280 --> 00:37:26.800
time transformation sequences. But this is not even a transformation.

693
00:37:27.119 --> 00:37:30.679
This is more of a reincarnation, Like this is a berth.

694
00:37:31.239 --> 00:37:35.519
So it's good. From nothing to everything. We just watch

695
00:37:35.639 --> 00:37:37.320
and it appears that it's a lot of it was

696
00:37:37.320 --> 00:37:41.320
shot in reverse, but you're watching flesh come to life

697
00:37:41.320 --> 00:37:44.239
and cover parts of the body, or the brain forming

698
00:37:44.519 --> 00:37:47.159
and the bones starting to come together, and you see

699
00:37:47.199 --> 00:37:49.480
his rib cage and then there's sort of like guts

700
00:37:49.519 --> 00:37:52.039
inside of it and covered in goo and he's dripping,

701
00:37:52.119 --> 00:37:54.360
and then all of a sudden, the final shot is

702
00:37:54.559 --> 00:37:57.239
just like the upper half of his torso rib cage,

703
00:37:57.400 --> 00:38:01.960
his bony arms and skull just screaming out in anguish

704
00:38:02.079 --> 00:38:04.880
or pain, and it's a horrific sequence, and the music

705
00:38:05.000 --> 00:38:07.639
is building and you're just like, what the fuck is

706
00:38:07.760 --> 00:38:09.480
happening this week?

707
00:38:09.559 --> 00:38:12.679
Because at first you think it's a creature, Yeah, exactly,

708
00:38:12.800 --> 00:38:14.360
And then it takes you a while like, oh wait,

709
00:38:14.559 --> 00:38:19.920
that's a person, and oh that's probably Frank so I

710
00:38:20.039 --> 00:38:23.159
like that too. That not sure what is happening at first,

711
00:38:23.199 --> 00:38:26.119
and then oh, okay, all right, I think I got it. Now.

712
00:38:26.440 --> 00:38:28.679
It's a lot of fun to watch. If you have

713
00:38:28.679 --> 00:38:30.440
a strong stomach, Yes, if.

714
00:38:30.320 --> 00:38:32.400
You have a strong sum you and I have the

715
00:38:32.440 --> 00:38:33.239
same three scenes.

716
00:38:33.320 --> 00:38:35.559
Yeah, I was gonna let you take this next one.

717
00:38:35.639 --> 00:38:36.679
Or whatever you like.

718
00:38:37.480 --> 00:38:41.679
I would even say in scenes just monster Frank in general.

719
00:38:41.800 --> 00:38:45.840
So after that initial I called the Frank's Resurrection scene

720
00:38:46.559 --> 00:38:51.840
just the Frank effects makeup effects itself. I love every

721
00:38:51.840 --> 00:38:55.440
phase of it. So Julie comes back up to the

722
00:38:55.480 --> 00:38:58.400
attic at some point because you're having a dinner party,

723
00:38:58.440 --> 00:39:01.280
and she kind of excused herself. She goes upstairs and

724
00:39:01.400 --> 00:39:03.960
she goes into the attic, and then that's when she

725
00:39:04.199 --> 00:39:07.880
sees Frank for the first time since the affair, thinking

726
00:39:08.280 --> 00:39:12.039
he's somewhere else, and we see a there's enough of

727
00:39:12.079 --> 00:39:14.519
Frank where he has the full body, but he doesn't

728
00:39:14.559 --> 00:39:17.519
have enough use of his legs, and he surprises Julia,

729
00:39:17.679 --> 00:39:20.239
and Julia tries to run, and he gets to the

730
00:39:20.239 --> 00:39:24.119
door before her and reveals himself and says, hey, I

731
00:39:24.159 --> 00:39:26.719
need some help. You promised me back when we're having

732
00:39:26.719 --> 00:39:28.480
to the fair that you would do anything for me,

733
00:39:29.000 --> 00:39:32.079
and he basically says he needs blood in order to

734
00:39:32.280 --> 00:39:36.039
finish this transformation and back to normal Frank. And of

735
00:39:36.079 --> 00:39:38.519
course he isn't shocked, but just that look they have

736
00:39:38.840 --> 00:39:43.400
him at that point, maybe he's sixty percent finished. So

737
00:39:43.440 --> 00:39:46.079
the more blood he gets, the more he's transforming. Close

738
00:39:46.159 --> 00:39:50.719
to his regular self. But every incarnation of Frank, I

739
00:39:50.760 --> 00:39:53.320
loved it because then there's the next one where he's

740
00:39:53.360 --> 00:39:56.280
basically skinless, and then it's just funny because then he

741
00:39:56.280 --> 00:39:59.320
starts wearing clothes, but he's bleeding all over his clothes,

742
00:39:59.360 --> 00:40:02.559
like sometimes clothes are literally soaked in his blood. So

743
00:40:02.840 --> 00:40:06.199
just every incarnation of what they referred to as monster Frank,

744
00:40:06.480 --> 00:40:07.760
he looks awesome.

745
00:40:08.280 --> 00:40:11.920
I couldn't agree with you more. Regarding the transformation, I'm

746
00:40:11.960 --> 00:40:14.559
glad you called the birthing scene the resurrection. I think

747
00:40:14.599 --> 00:40:17.719
I said reincarnation. Resurrection is the correct word to describe

748
00:40:17.719 --> 00:40:20.920
that initial scene when Frank comes back to life. So

749
00:40:21.039 --> 00:40:23.440
if people are wondering what the hell this movie is about,

750
00:40:23.480 --> 00:40:26.159
this is kind of the major through line through the

751
00:40:26.199 --> 00:40:30.159
bulk of the movie. Frank had opened the puzzle box

752
00:40:30.239 --> 00:40:33.599
and went to this hellish other world ruled by these cenobites,

753
00:40:34.119 --> 00:40:37.480
and we think, well, he's trapped there forever. But what

754
00:40:37.639 --> 00:40:41.159
ended up happening was some remainder of his guts were

755
00:40:41.199 --> 00:40:46.880
still under the floorboards. Larry's blood triggered this resurrection. Now

756
00:40:47.280 --> 00:40:50.679
Frank's coming back to life and he needs more blood

757
00:40:50.760 --> 00:40:54.119
to become fully formed. As a human being again, and

758
00:40:54.159 --> 00:40:57.960
he is recruiting his ex lover Julia to help him

759
00:40:58.000 --> 00:41:01.440
with this, and Julia throughout the film then has to

760
00:41:02.000 --> 00:41:07.760
bring him sacrifice these sacrificial men, which then she will

761
00:41:07.880 --> 00:41:12.079
kill for him, or at least knock unconscious, and Frank

762
00:41:12.119 --> 00:41:15.480
will then take their life force, their blood and continue

763
00:41:15.519 --> 00:41:18.760
to grow and become more human. And that's kind of

764
00:41:18.760 --> 00:41:20.840
the through line through this, just to explain for the

765
00:41:20.880 --> 00:41:21.840
listeners in case.

766
00:41:21.800 --> 00:41:25.239
Frank is obsessed with sensual pleasure, that's what it is,

767
00:41:25.360 --> 00:41:28.199
to the point where sex is not enough for him,

768
00:41:28.519 --> 00:41:31.000
and that's why he seeks out this box because opening

769
00:41:31.039 --> 00:41:32.840
the box is supposed to take him to this realm

770
00:41:32.880 --> 00:41:36.519
of extreme pleasure, but that's not really what it is.

771
00:41:36.599 --> 00:41:41.079
It's pleasure and pain, interdimensional pleasure and pain. So he

772
00:41:41.119 --> 00:41:44.679
gets trapped in this dimension and the blood is almost

773
00:41:44.760 --> 00:41:45.960
like a key to get him out.

774
00:41:46.199 --> 00:41:49.840
Correct he does say, yeah, pain and pleasure indivisible is

775
00:41:49.840 --> 00:41:53.880
what he discovered in this other realm. So what the

776
00:41:53.920 --> 00:41:56.000
scene I was going to go over briefly was what

777
00:41:56.039 --> 00:41:58.840
I just called the first kill because what he said

778
00:41:58.880 --> 00:42:02.400
when he first reveals himself to Julia, the blood on

779
00:42:02.440 --> 00:42:04.440
the floor, it brought me back, and she's like, back

780
00:42:04.440 --> 00:42:06.199
from where And he's like, you can't leave me like this.

781
00:42:06.280 --> 00:42:08.320
The blood brought me this far. I need more. You

782
00:42:08.360 --> 00:42:11.880
have to heal me. So she agrees to help him,

783
00:42:12.239 --> 00:42:15.480
and Julia goes to a bar she pretends to be single.

784
00:42:16.039 --> 00:42:18.880
We assume this is during the day when Larry's off

785
00:42:18.920 --> 00:42:21.880
to work. While she's at the bar being her single

786
00:42:22.000 --> 00:42:25.119
version of herself. A gentleman notices she brings him back

787
00:42:25.119 --> 00:42:28.519
to the house. She has some trepidation because she's never

788
00:42:28.559 --> 00:42:31.159
done this before. She's about to sacrifice this guy to

789
00:42:31.639 --> 00:42:36.199
this monster Frank, and so she eventually takes him upstairs

790
00:42:36.239 --> 00:42:39.519
to the attic room. This is confusing to me, Bill,

791
00:42:39.639 --> 00:42:41.800
Is it an attic or is it just a room?

792
00:42:41.840 --> 00:42:44.599
It's one of the rooms on the upstairs level, right,

793
00:42:44.840 --> 00:42:47.599
but it looks like an attic. It's hard to describe.

794
00:42:47.679 --> 00:42:51.079
It's almost like an attic that's separated into three different rooms,

795
00:42:51.280 --> 00:42:52.760
which I've never seen before.

796
00:42:53.039 --> 00:42:57.679
Yeah, it's a strange configuration. Regardless, she's she's taken this

797
00:42:57.760 --> 00:43:01.960
poor sap who's really drunk, up to this room and

798
00:43:02.599 --> 00:43:05.039
she's going to have sex with him on the floor.

799
00:43:05.079 --> 00:43:07.039
But he says he's got to use the bathroom first,

800
00:43:07.320 --> 00:43:09.360
and then she goes for a hammer that she has

801
00:43:09.480 --> 00:43:12.639
prepared hanging off on the wall to the side hidden,

802
00:43:13.239 --> 00:43:17.840
and she decides to basically beat him to near death.

803
00:43:18.079 --> 00:43:20.280
And she goes to town on this guy and smacks him,

804
00:43:20.320 --> 00:43:22.440
and there's some great bloody effects. This guy's face is

805
00:43:22.480 --> 00:43:25.639
all messed up. And now this is the first victim.

806
00:43:25.760 --> 00:43:29.960
This will be the first the feeding for Frank. And

807
00:43:30.360 --> 00:43:33.440
there's a great shot. Actually, the shots of Monster Frank

808
00:43:33.519 --> 00:43:36.480
before he's formed his legs, when he's just slithering across

809
00:43:36.559 --> 00:43:40.599
the floor is really creepy. And before Frank's about to

810
00:43:40.599 --> 00:43:42.800
go to town on this victim, you hear him say

811
00:43:42.840 --> 00:43:45.239
to Julia, don't look at me, because it's going to

812
00:43:45.280 --> 00:43:46.960
be awful what he's about to do to this guy.

813
00:43:47.320 --> 00:43:50.599
So she goes to exit the attic room and you

814
00:43:50.679 --> 00:43:53.039
just see this quick shot of the slithering half body

815
00:43:53.079 --> 00:43:56.239
of Frank going to the injured victim to suck his

816
00:43:56.360 --> 00:43:59.199
life force out, and you just hear these gross some

817
00:43:59.239 --> 00:44:03.519
good sound as in this too, these gross like sound

818
00:44:03.559 --> 00:44:06.519
effects of him just eating this guy. So I thought

819
00:44:06.559 --> 00:44:09.079
Claire Higgins as Julia was really good in this scene.

820
00:44:09.280 --> 00:44:12.320
She's freaking out she's had to commit murder here basically

821
00:44:12.519 --> 00:44:16.559
for Frank, and she leaves this attic room. She goes

822
00:44:16.599 --> 00:44:18.800
to clean herself up. She's got blood all over herself.

823
00:44:18.880 --> 00:44:21.360
Larry comes home in the middle of all this, but

824
00:44:21.559 --> 00:44:25.920
afterward she goes back into the attic room and she

825
00:44:26.039 --> 00:44:27.960
has to take the guy's body out and she puts

826
00:44:28.000 --> 00:44:31.199
it in a different room. Frank is standing before her.

827
00:44:31.239 --> 00:44:34.920
Now his legs are formed, and he says, see, it's

828
00:44:34.960 --> 00:44:37.360
making me whole again. Every drop of blood puts more

829
00:44:37.360 --> 00:44:39.559
flesh on my bones. And we both want that, don't

830
00:44:39.559 --> 00:44:41.559
we come here? I want to touch you. Come to

831
00:44:41.639 --> 00:44:45.880
daddy so creepy, but he looks fantastic. Just to say,

832
00:44:46.199 --> 00:44:48.400
I'm just agreeing what Bill is saying. The makeup effects

833
00:44:48.400 --> 00:44:51.760
on skinless Frank look fantastic. He takes her hand. There's

834
00:44:51.760 --> 00:44:55.159
goo dripping everywhere this whole time. You see partial bones

835
00:44:55.280 --> 00:44:57.960
on his head. It just looks so cool because there's

836
00:44:58.000 --> 00:45:00.559
just a dude standing here. It's like, have you ever

837
00:45:00.599 --> 00:45:02.519
been to the body exhibit? It's like that. I mean,

838
00:45:02.559 --> 00:45:06.199
he's just got no skin, but it looks real. I

839
00:45:06.199 --> 00:45:08.199
don't know if there's anything, but it's just that that

840
00:45:08.239 --> 00:45:13.159
first kill sequence is pretty impactful, and I thought Claire

841
00:45:13.199 --> 00:45:14.239
Higgins acting was great.

842
00:45:14.280 --> 00:45:16.000
Now I think I would have to agree with you

843
00:45:16.480 --> 00:45:20.280
also with her acting in that scene, because at first,

844
00:45:20.639 --> 00:45:23.119
here's Frank asking her to kill and she doesn't want

845
00:45:23.159 --> 00:45:25.679
to do it, but at the same time, she's obsessed

846
00:45:25.679 --> 00:45:29.000
with him, and this is what obsessions, calling her to

847
00:45:29.079 --> 00:45:32.239
kill someone. And then in the middle of the kill

848
00:45:32.599 --> 00:45:35.320
you can see she's getting pleasure out of it. So

849
00:45:35.320 --> 00:45:37.719
she's done a one to eighty. Yep. I think how

850
00:45:37.760 --> 00:45:40.800
those themes come about in that scene are great. And

851
00:45:40.840 --> 00:45:43.760
there's that one shot when the guy falls and his

852
00:45:43.880 --> 00:45:46.280
mouth open and you can see that she knocked out

853
00:45:46.280 --> 00:45:48.239
like three of his teeth with the hammer on the

854
00:45:48.280 --> 00:45:50.079
second hit, that's what hits him in the back of

855
00:45:50.119 --> 00:45:53.199
the head and then smacks him across the face. It's

856
00:45:53.199 --> 00:45:56.800
some gory shit, man, it's really violent. It's super violent,

857
00:45:56.920 --> 00:45:58.760
and it's just scary of the fact that she can

858
00:45:58.760 --> 00:46:02.400
bring herself to do that almost so easily, because then

859
00:46:02.440 --> 00:46:04.840
she keeps doving it over and over again. So yeah,

860
00:46:04.880 --> 00:46:06.559
I do like her in that scene.

861
00:46:06.719 --> 00:46:09.159
You're absolutely right, she's playing a lot of levels here

862
00:46:09.320 --> 00:46:12.039
because she's going back and forth as to there's obviously

863
00:46:12.119 --> 00:46:15.360
dealing with some morality of the situation. But when then

864
00:46:15.559 --> 00:46:18.119
after she murders that guy, you can see she's taking

865
00:46:18.159 --> 00:46:20.400
some pleasure in it. Then when she goes into the

866
00:46:20.400 --> 00:46:23.519
bathroom and she's wiping blood off of her face, she

867
00:46:23.760 --> 00:46:26.639
is in shock, and it's great. But then when she

868
00:46:26.800 --> 00:46:29.840
goes back to see Frank, and Frank is getting better

869
00:46:30.199 --> 00:46:33.079
and more fully formed, and he's standing on two legs now,

870
00:46:33.239 --> 00:46:36.639
and they have this conversation and Frank is just a

871
00:46:36.679 --> 00:46:40.039
dirty bastard and he's saying these things like come to daddy.

872
00:46:40.480 --> 00:46:45.719
He's touching her with his sinewy, goopy like hands and

873
00:46:46.159 --> 00:46:49.039
she takes his hand and this is a callback to

874
00:46:49.280 --> 00:46:51.320
one of the flashbacks early in the film, and puts

875
00:46:51.679 --> 00:46:54.960
his finger on her lips. She caresses her lips with

876
00:46:55.039 --> 00:46:59.599
his gross, skinless finger, and basically that sums up this movie.

877
00:46:59.639 --> 00:47:01.840
That's like, what are we doing here? What is this?

878
00:47:02.280 --> 00:47:07.079
Because there's these sexual overtones and it's real horror, it's

879
00:47:07.159 --> 00:47:09.800
body horror, it's all of it combined, and she's playing

880
00:47:09.800 --> 00:47:13.159
the levels and anyway, that's what I'm talking about. That's

881
00:47:13.199 --> 00:47:14.679
why the scene is I think.

882
00:47:15.039 --> 00:47:19.000
Very effective, agreed, And last, what do we conclude with

883
00:47:19.039 --> 00:47:19.800
that we both like.

884
00:47:20.000 --> 00:47:22.800
What are we talking about here? I believe Bill and

885
00:47:22.800 --> 00:47:26.159
I share our last favorite scene, which would be Kirsty

886
00:47:26.599 --> 00:47:29.440
makes a deal with the cenobites at the hospital.

887
00:47:29.840 --> 00:47:34.920
Yeah. So Kirsty is following Julia and sees that Julia

888
00:47:35.000 --> 00:47:37.519
is bringing the man to the house and she goes

889
00:47:37.599 --> 00:47:40.559
upstairs to see what's going on and finds this man

890
00:47:40.719 --> 00:47:44.199
partially dead because Julia's tried to kill him. Frank's been

891
00:47:44.239 --> 00:47:48.639
sucking the essence out and then what monster. Frank reveals

892
00:47:48.679 --> 00:47:53.320
himself to Kirsty as her uncle, and then he almost

893
00:47:53.559 --> 00:47:56.199
tries to you know, I'm just gonna say rape. He

894
00:47:56.320 --> 00:47:59.599
just tries to rape her, and she tries to escape.

895
00:47:59.639 --> 00:48:02.920
She finds the puzzle box. She sees Frank's very upset

896
00:48:03.039 --> 00:48:05.320
that she picked it up, and she throws it out

897
00:48:05.360 --> 00:48:07.519
the window and then runs out of the house and

898
00:48:07.559 --> 00:48:11.079
picks it up and passes out. Wakes up in the hospital,

899
00:48:11.320 --> 00:48:14.440
no idea what's going on. The nurse or the doctor

900
00:48:14.480 --> 00:48:15.519
comes in and leaves her.

901
00:48:15.519 --> 00:48:17.639
The box, which is a wild thing.

902
00:48:18.119 --> 00:48:21.119
It's such a weird So she's in the room but

903
00:48:21.199 --> 00:48:23.039
nothing else to do, so she starts playing with the

904
00:48:23.079 --> 00:48:27.239
puzzle box. And whoops. She accidentally figures it out and

905
00:48:27.440 --> 00:48:32.039
opens it, and strange things start happening. Wall opens into

906
00:48:32.079 --> 00:48:35.880
her room and she goes through this hallway and that's

907
00:48:35.880 --> 00:48:38.840
when we see the engineer, and the engineer chases her

908
00:48:38.880 --> 00:48:41.360
out of the hallway and she runs back into the

909
00:48:41.400 --> 00:48:45.920
hospital room and she turns around and the wall is closed,

910
00:48:46.079 --> 00:48:48.360
but she can hear that creature on the other side

911
00:48:48.360 --> 00:48:50.679
of the wall. And then one of my favorite shots

912
00:48:50.880 --> 00:48:53.119
is we see one of the walls of the hospital

913
00:48:53.199 --> 00:48:56.519
room and it turns black with this yellow glow behind it,

914
00:48:56.559 --> 00:48:58.800
and then we got the fog rolling in and then

915
00:48:58.840 --> 00:49:02.440
all this crazy symbolism with the TV going on and

916
00:49:02.480 --> 00:49:07.360
off with a blooming flower and Ivy is reverse flowing

917
00:49:07.519 --> 00:49:10.960
with blood and all of a sudden, I think, is

918
00:49:10.960 --> 00:49:14.599
it the chatter Cinnabyte Yes basically backs her into her

919
00:49:14.639 --> 00:49:17.599
corner and sticks its fingers in our mouth, and then

920
00:49:17.639 --> 00:49:20.719
we meet the rest of the Cinnabytes and they basically

921
00:49:20.719 --> 00:49:22.960
told her, well, you open the box, you're coming with us,

922
00:49:23.280 --> 00:49:27.000
and she's like, uh no, I had no intention to

923
00:49:27.039 --> 00:49:29.079
open this box, and they're like, well, you open it,

924
00:49:29.119 --> 00:49:31.639
you got to come with us, and that's when she

925
00:49:31.800 --> 00:49:35.039
puts one on one together and realizes Frank had opened

926
00:49:35.079 --> 00:49:39.519
this box and she says, I can take it to

927
00:49:39.559 --> 00:49:42.599
Frank because Frank's escaped her world, and they don't believe

928
00:49:42.599 --> 00:49:45.480
her at first, but they decide to make a deal.

929
00:49:45.480 --> 00:49:47.559
If you can prove to us that Frank has escaped,

930
00:49:47.760 --> 00:49:51.519
we will take him instead of you maybe, and at

931
00:49:51.519 --> 00:49:54.159
that point they let her go. But yeah, this is

932
00:49:54.159 --> 00:49:55.679
the first time we really get to see all the

933
00:49:55.880 --> 00:49:59.599
cinnabytes and they get the talk. Just the scene when

934
00:49:59.679 --> 00:50:04.400
she's in the hospital and all these weird things start happening.

935
00:50:04.639 --> 00:50:06.719
I just thought that was really cool. But you can

936
00:50:06.760 --> 00:50:10.000
do a little budget sometimes impresses me, and that's definitely

937
00:50:10.000 --> 00:50:10.800
one of these moments.

938
00:50:11.280 --> 00:50:16.320
For sure, it's really cool. I'm a little hot and

939
00:50:16.360 --> 00:50:19.199
cold on the engineer that we'd monster chasing her down

940
00:50:19.199 --> 00:50:21.880
the hallway in the sequence. It's still kind of cool,

941
00:50:21.960 --> 00:50:24.360
like it looks cool, but you're watching it by today's

942
00:50:24.360 --> 00:50:27.199
standards too, So as an adult, I'm watching and go, Okay,

943
00:50:27.239 --> 00:50:31.039
that's a little cheesy, but cool design of the creature. Regardless,

944
00:50:31.119 --> 00:50:34.960
it's for me. When after that first sequence and she's

945
00:50:35.039 --> 00:50:39.440
back in the hospital room and the walls then turn

946
00:50:39.519 --> 00:50:42.480
to black and you have the glow emitting from behind

947
00:50:43.119 --> 00:50:45.440
is really cool. It's when the cenobytes appear and that

948
00:50:45.559 --> 00:50:48.400
chatterer is really cool. But like, you nailed it, you

949
00:50:48.440 --> 00:50:51.880
said it. This is really the meaty scene for the cenobytes,

950
00:50:51.920 --> 00:50:53.960
when we get to see them in all their glory.

951
00:50:54.000 --> 00:50:59.880
We see them clearer and we get dialogue between them

952
00:51:00.119 --> 00:51:02.719
and Kirsty and we understand a little bit more what

953
00:51:02.719 --> 00:51:05.559
they're about because the lead cenobyte says, the box you

954
00:51:05.679 --> 00:51:08.519
opened it, we came, and she says, who are you?

955
00:51:09.239 --> 00:51:12.400
And he responds explorers in the further regions of experience,

956
00:51:12.519 --> 00:51:16.639
demons to some angels, to others, and she's like, go

957
00:51:16.719 --> 00:51:21.000
to hell, and the female cenobite says, we can't not alone,

958
00:51:21.679 --> 00:51:25.280
and then lead cenebite replies, you solved the box. We came.

959
00:51:25.360 --> 00:51:28.599
Now you must come with us taste our pleasures. And

960
00:51:28.639 --> 00:51:30.519
it's just like these lines and the way that Doug

961
00:51:30.559 --> 00:51:36.119
Bradley delivers them, And of course at the end, Kirsty says, hey,

962
00:51:36.599 --> 00:51:40.639
Frank Cotton escaped you guys, and they're like, well, so,

963
00:51:40.760 --> 00:51:42.159
what what does it have to do with you? And

964
00:51:42.199 --> 00:51:43.599
she says, I can lead you to him and you

965
00:51:43.639 --> 00:51:46.119
can take him back instead of me. So she's making

966
00:51:46.119 --> 00:51:48.599
that deal and that's when that big quote comes in

967
00:51:48.639 --> 00:51:53.760
from the top, when we'll tear your soul apart right there.

968
00:51:53.840 --> 00:51:56.519
So it's amazing if you don't. It's like I'm trying

969
00:51:56.559 --> 00:51:59.159
to describe some of these cenebytes for the audience a

970
00:51:59.199 --> 00:52:02.639
little bit like there severely goth. They're wrapped tightly with

971
00:52:02.719 --> 00:52:06.239
these black leather costumes. The lead cenobite has what looks

972
00:52:06.280 --> 00:52:10.239
like a priest's skirt. They're all bald with very pale makeup.

973
00:52:10.719 --> 00:52:13.320
Lead cenobite of course has the pins or are they

974
00:52:13.320 --> 00:52:16.159
thin nails sticking out of his face all over the place,

975
00:52:16.159 --> 00:52:18.199
with like a grid of nails on his face and

976
00:52:18.239 --> 00:52:23.000
his head, black eye contacts. They have bloody open gashes,

977
00:52:23.199 --> 00:52:26.719
wounds on their chests, their bodies. The chatterer's lips are

978
00:52:26.840 --> 00:52:29.920
pulled way back almost over his head to expose his

979
00:52:30.039 --> 00:52:32.800
jaws that are clattering and chattering the whole time. It's

980
00:52:32.920 --> 00:52:35.280
pretty awesome, and it's like who thought this up?

981
00:52:35.920 --> 00:52:40.039
Seriously, It's like Tim Burton designs when r X ray

982
00:52:40.079 --> 00:52:47.400
it actually, hmm, good call. There's some freaky stuff. Okay.

983
00:52:47.400 --> 00:52:50.480
Trying to move on to Swiss cheese and complaint department,

984
00:52:50.559 --> 00:52:52.519
And why don't we call Swiss cheese.

985
00:52:52.239 --> 00:52:54.880
Because although this movie is delicious, it does have hook

986
00:52:54.960 --> 00:52:56.199
piercing skin holes.

987
00:52:56.480 --> 00:52:59.159
Yes, it doesn't have those hook piercing skin hooles. We

988
00:52:59.320 --> 00:53:02.320
just file with the complaints apartment. So, Jason, would you

989
00:53:02.360 --> 00:53:04.599
have four cheese or complaints?

990
00:53:05.000 --> 00:53:08.400
Well, I'm kind of I think cutting to that first

991
00:53:08.519 --> 00:53:12.719
kill sequence actually, because I just have some logistical questions.

992
00:53:12.760 --> 00:53:15.679
I guess here, when Julia is killing these men, she

993
00:53:15.719 --> 00:53:20.559
where she's bringing these sacrificial men to Frank so he

994
00:53:20.639 --> 00:53:23.360
can suck their blood or eat their flat, whatever it

995
00:53:23.400 --> 00:53:26.719
is he needs to do to reform. Where's she putting

996
00:53:26.760 --> 00:53:29.159
these dead bodies? We see her pick up one and

997
00:53:29.360 --> 00:53:32.280
like stash the body in one of the side rooms

998
00:53:32.280 --> 00:53:36.119
of the attic, and I'm like, she's just gonna put

999
00:53:36.159 --> 00:53:39.239
the body in there. They just moved into this house

1000
00:53:39.280 --> 00:53:42.480
and they're still unpacking and going through things. I wouldn't

1001
00:53:42.480 --> 00:53:45.360
think that's a great place to stash a dead body

1002
00:53:45.639 --> 00:53:46.639
that's been mutilated.

1003
00:53:46.760 --> 00:53:49.480
I'm with you one hundred percent. That's what I had too. Okay,

1004
00:53:49.800 --> 00:53:52.800
when they eventually start smelling, when you wonder why you

1005
00:53:52.840 --> 00:53:54.599
had like eight thousand flies in your house.

1006
00:53:54.880 --> 00:53:57.760
M I didn't get that either. Yeah, it's weird because

1007
00:53:57.800 --> 00:53:59.599
we then have to assume she eventually, I mean, there's

1008
00:53:59.679 --> 00:54:03.920
events three bodies in that room. But so yeah, I

1009
00:54:03.960 --> 00:54:07.559
had that, and that also when Kirsty you were talking

1010
00:54:07.599 --> 00:54:10.960
about this, when Kirsty comes home in the middle of

1011
00:54:11.440 --> 00:54:14.559
Julia taking one of the guys, luring one of the

1012
00:54:14.559 --> 00:54:17.519
guys up to the room to have Frank kill eat

1013
00:54:17.559 --> 00:54:20.719
this guy whatever it is. Eventually Kirsty goes up to

1014
00:54:20.760 --> 00:54:25.000
the room, Frank reveals himself to her, tries to rape her.

1015
00:54:25.119 --> 00:54:27.679
She gets the box throws out all of that the

1016
00:54:27.719 --> 00:54:30.840
first time Kirsty sees Frank, because what happens in the

1017
00:54:30.880 --> 00:54:35.000
sequence is Kirsty goes upstairs to the attic area and

1018
00:54:35.239 --> 00:54:37.760
Julia has gone and hidden in another room. I don't

1019
00:54:37.800 --> 00:54:41.079
know why Julia is hiding at this point, but the

1020
00:54:42.119 --> 00:54:44.800
not the that we think the one guy that she

1021
00:54:45.119 --> 00:54:47.760
Julia just lured into the room for Frank, he's not

1022
00:54:47.880 --> 00:54:51.280
totally dead. He kind of leans out of the attic

1023
00:54:51.360 --> 00:54:56.119
room all gray faced and bloody, and he's reaching towards Kirsty,

1024
00:54:56.159 --> 00:54:58.760
who's freaking out like what the hell's happening, saying help

1025
00:54:58.840 --> 00:55:02.360
me help me, and eventually Frank has to expose himself

1026
00:55:02.400 --> 00:55:04.880
to Kirsty. He comes out and grabs the dead guy

1027
00:55:04.920 --> 00:55:08.280
and kills him off. And if you are Kirsty and

1028
00:55:08.360 --> 00:55:11.440
you see the skinless person in front of you, because

1029
00:55:11.440 --> 00:55:14.960
it's Frank, He's just colored in blood without any skin,

1030
00:55:15.639 --> 00:55:20.480
I would freak the f out. She just simply goes no, no,

1031
00:55:20.920 --> 00:55:23.360
And then Frank starts talking to her and says, I'm Frank,

1032
00:55:23.400 --> 00:55:27.400
and oh, you've grown up, Kirsty, You're beautiful. But her

1033
00:55:27.440 --> 00:55:30.719
reaction was confounding to me. To seeing Frank for the

1034
00:55:30.719 --> 00:55:33.440
first time, you would lose your mind and run the

1035
00:55:33.480 --> 00:55:35.400
hell out of the house, right, Yeah.

1036
00:55:35.400 --> 00:55:38.920
I would never hear him saying that he was uncle Frank,

1037
00:55:39.400 --> 00:55:41.599
or might have caught that while I was running out

1038
00:55:41.599 --> 00:55:43.679
the front door going to the police.

1039
00:55:43.559 --> 00:55:47.000
Yeah, but it's a weird reaction she has to seeing

1040
00:55:47.079 --> 00:55:49.159
him for the first time, because it's as if she

1041
00:55:49.440 --> 00:55:52.400
recognizes him as Frank, because she just looks at him

1042
00:55:52.440 --> 00:55:56.000
and goes no, no. And I was like, what are

1043
00:55:56.039 --> 00:55:57.840
you talking? You don't even know who that is.

1044
00:55:58.480 --> 00:56:00.800
Yeah, got to move the story, I guess.

1045
00:56:01.159 --> 00:56:03.559
Yeah, Yeah, so I have another I got some other

1046
00:56:03.599 --> 00:56:05.599
things to say. Go ahead, man, what do you got here?

1047
00:56:05.679 --> 00:56:10.840
All right? This house is disgusting. And we have where

1048
00:56:10.920 --> 00:56:14.199
Larry and Julie are downstairs and they're watching boxing match

1049
00:56:15.280 --> 00:56:17.920
and Larry hears something. He's like, oh, let me go

1050
00:56:18.000 --> 00:56:21.280
upstairs and investigate, and of course Julia is all worried

1051
00:56:21.280 --> 00:56:24.039
about it. Goes up to the attic, wow, and he

1052
00:56:24.159 --> 00:56:28.840
sees rats, rats in his attic, and he doesn't seem

1053
00:56:28.880 --> 00:56:33.320
at all worried about that. I'm like, rats, they can

1054
00:56:33.320 --> 00:56:36.519
spread disease. I'd be sending up an exterminator and then

1055
00:56:36.559 --> 00:56:39.000
we'd have the exterminator scene where he gets killed by Frank.

1056
00:56:39.079 --> 00:56:42.440
But how you not at all phased that you have

1057
00:56:42.679 --> 00:56:43.519
rats in your house?

1058
00:56:44.079 --> 00:56:44.960
It's gross.

1059
00:56:45.480 --> 00:56:48.199
Let alone just the house itself is in disrepair and

1060
00:56:48.239 --> 00:56:50.920
they don't seem to be doing anything about it. Everything

1061
00:56:51.000 --> 00:56:54.000
in this movie is disgusting. Even there's that makeout scene

1062
00:56:54.360 --> 00:56:56.760
with Kirstine and our boyfriend in the front of this

1063
00:56:56.840 --> 00:56:59.639
wall that looks like it's like fece smeared on it,

1064
00:56:59.679 --> 00:57:01.400
and I'm like, oh, I would not be kissing there.

1065
00:57:01.440 --> 00:57:02.840
I'm sure police.

1066
00:57:03.039 --> 00:57:08.199
Kiss Yeah, all valid complaints and uh, it's very curious,

1067
00:57:08.280 --> 00:57:10.360
but I agree. You see rats in the house that's

1068
00:57:10.360 --> 00:57:13.119
a real problem. There has to be some reaction there. Yeah,

1069
00:57:13.480 --> 00:57:17.159
you just don't say, oh, you know, that's normal just

1070
00:57:17.159 --> 00:57:20.719
to have rats in Yeah, probably not good. But you're

1071
00:57:20.760 --> 00:57:23.360
right this whole like you when you point out these details,

1072
00:57:23.400 --> 00:57:26.519
the whole movie is really gross. It's very unsettling.

1073
00:57:26.880 --> 00:57:30.800
Oh yeah, maggots, cockroaches, disgusting.

1074
00:57:31.000 --> 00:57:33.199
Yeah, it's almost like you can smell it through the

1075
00:57:33.320 --> 00:57:36.599
TV screen. Yes, you know, this ties into the scene

1076
00:57:36.599 --> 00:57:39.159
I was just complaining about where I was like, why

1077
00:57:39.199 --> 00:57:41.960
isn't Kirsty reacting in a different way to seeing Frank

1078
00:57:42.000 --> 00:57:46.480
for the first time as this skinless person, because that's horrific.

1079
00:57:47.239 --> 00:57:51.079
But after that sequence, because they then Bill described they

1080
00:57:51.119 --> 00:57:54.000
go into the room and they tussle a little bit

1081
00:57:54.440 --> 00:57:58.239
over the box, and basically Frank all that Frank says

1082
00:57:58.360 --> 00:58:00.920
is give me the box, and she says you want it,

1083
00:58:01.199 --> 00:58:03.679
well you can have it, and throws it out the

1084
00:58:03.679 --> 00:58:06.679
window and that's it. Then she goes out, she run

1085
00:58:06.760 --> 00:58:09.440
finally runs out, grabs the box, and then she ends

1086
00:58:09.519 --> 00:58:13.440
up in the hospital. So later on, when she unlocks

1087
00:58:13.519 --> 00:58:15.880
the box, the puzzle box in the hospital room and

1088
00:58:15.920 --> 00:58:19.840
the center, the cenobytes are summoned. She makes this deal

1089
00:58:19.840 --> 00:58:22.079
with him. But I'm like, how would you even have

1090
00:58:22.119 --> 00:58:25.199
any knowledge of the fact that Frank had escaped them?

1091
00:58:25.280 --> 00:58:28.639
She doesn't know any of that, right, she doesn't have

1092
00:58:28.639 --> 00:58:31.159
any knowledge. So we quickly put that together. So all

1093
00:58:31.159 --> 00:58:33.599
of a sudden, now she's making a deal with the cenobytes, going,

1094
00:58:33.880 --> 00:58:36.280
do you know Frank Cotton? Frank Cotton got away from you.

1095
00:58:36.960 --> 00:58:39.440
She doesn't know who the Cenobytes are, who, what this

1096
00:58:39.639 --> 00:58:43.119
world is? That Frank Cotton had been there and was

1097
00:58:43.119 --> 00:58:45.760
destroyed by them initially and then was resurrected. She doesn't

1098
00:58:45.800 --> 00:58:48.159
have any of that knowledge. But now she's making a

1099
00:58:48.199 --> 00:58:52.119
deal saying, Frank Cotton escaped you. I'll give you Frank

1100
00:58:52.239 --> 00:58:54.199
and you let me go. How would you even know

1101
00:58:54.239 --> 00:58:56.239
any of that? There's a hole there.

1102
00:58:56.320 --> 00:58:59.239
Right, Yeah. It was kind of funny, like does Senatebites

1103
00:58:59.280 --> 00:59:03.519
even know he's Frank Cotton? Yeah, let me check my rolodex,

1104
00:59:04.039 --> 00:59:06.159
right right, right, that's that could be a problem.

1105
00:59:06.400 --> 00:59:07.800
Yeah, uh for me.

1106
00:59:08.719 --> 00:59:11.400
When Ashley does come back to the house after her

1107
00:59:11.519 --> 00:59:15.000
stay at the hospital, cannot figure out there's something off

1108
00:59:15.079 --> 00:59:18.760
with her father, That's what I had. Next, That's exactly

1109
00:59:18.760 --> 00:59:22.719
what I had, Because we find out that Larry is

1110
00:59:23.039 --> 00:59:26.280
a little queasy when it comes to blood, and you

1111
00:59:26.320 --> 00:59:28.320
could tell he's got blood in his collar, you could

1112
00:59:28.320 --> 00:59:31.360
tell that he's got blood on his forehead and he's

1113
00:59:31.719 --> 00:59:34.519
acting normal. No way in hell, how do you not

1114
00:59:34.679 --> 00:59:38.519
see that? It's so obvious. I get you're in a

1115
00:59:38.519 --> 00:59:42.239
frantic state, but you would still know something is off

1116
00:59:42.519 --> 00:59:45.320
with your dad if he looked like that, like why,

1117
00:59:45.559 --> 00:59:47.559
you know, why? Why is their blood? And then if

1118
00:59:47.559 --> 00:59:49.840
you looked down on it and didn't seem at all

1119
00:59:49.880 --> 00:59:51.960
phased by it, then you're like, oh, wait, you're not

1120
00:59:52.039 --> 00:59:53.639
my dad. I gotta get the hell out of here.

1121
00:59:53.960 --> 00:59:57.239
Thousand percent. So here at this point in the story,

1122
00:59:57.480 --> 01:00:00.239
Kirsty has now come back to the house with the

1123
01:00:00.280 --> 01:00:03.039
puzzle box, which is another complaint I have because it

1124
01:00:03.079 --> 01:00:06.599
actually disappears it's in her possession, and then it disappears

1125
01:00:06.599 --> 01:00:09.119
halfway through this whole sequence. This whole ending has a

1126
01:00:09.159 --> 01:00:12.920
lot of problems, but the one being obviously she would

1127
01:00:12.920 --> 01:00:15.119
know something's up with her dad since he's got blood

1128
01:00:15.199 --> 01:00:18.599
all surrounding the outside of his face, because we know

1129
01:00:18.679 --> 01:00:21.760
as an audience that that's not her dad, that's actually Frank.

1130
01:00:21.800 --> 01:00:24.400
Frank had killed a father, which they skip, we don't

1131
01:00:24.400 --> 01:00:26.800
get to see that. I understand kind of why they

1132
01:00:26.800 --> 01:00:30.559
did that because we're supposed to think that Larry is Larry,

1133
01:00:30.760 --> 01:00:34.679
but then find the reveal is Larry actually is Frank.

1134
01:00:34.719 --> 01:00:39.039
Frank just took Larry's skin. Frank is actually wearing Larry's skin.

1135
01:00:39.639 --> 01:00:43.559
So Kirsty thinks Larry's Larry that she's talking, but no,

1136
01:00:43.599 --> 01:00:45.639
it's obvious he's got blood everywhere. So I agree with

1137
01:00:45.679 --> 01:00:47.760
you on that. Do you want to get into this

1138
01:00:47.840 --> 01:00:50.239
ending sequence? Did you have any other complaints because I

1139
01:00:50.280 --> 01:00:56.039
had just commented ending. Yeah. So now Kirsty, she had

1140
01:00:56.039 --> 01:00:57.480
the box and then the Box of the Spirit, well

1141
01:00:57.480 --> 01:00:59.519
it ended up in the death grip of Julie at

1142
01:00:59.519 --> 01:01:03.519
one point. To get the puzzle box back, and now

1143
01:01:03.920 --> 01:01:07.320
what she's going to do is vanquish each cenobyte throughout

1144
01:01:07.320 --> 01:01:10.800
because the cenobytes, although they made this deal with Kirsty

1145
01:01:11.320 --> 01:01:15.199
that if they got Frank Cotton back, she would be

1146
01:01:15.199 --> 01:01:18.719
allowed to live, well, they go back on their deal

1147
01:01:18.760 --> 01:01:21.400
and they're coming after her for some reason. So she

1148
01:01:21.480 --> 01:01:25.239
gets ahold of the puzzle box once again starts reconfiguring

1149
01:01:25.280 --> 01:01:29.960
it to basically send each cenebyte one at a time

1150
01:01:30.119 --> 01:01:33.639
back to this hellish realm, and so we watch this

1151
01:01:33.719 --> 01:01:39.079
happen as the whole house is falling apart around Kersey.

1152
01:01:39.199 --> 01:01:41.599
So she's going through the house as the cenobytes are

1153
01:01:41.639 --> 01:01:45.920
chasing her, and you get to see her like tweak

1154
01:01:46.000 --> 01:01:49.000
the box and all of a sudden, lead cenebite disappears

1155
01:01:49.199 --> 01:01:53.400
and tweak it now female cenobite disappears, and at one

1156
01:01:53.400 --> 01:01:57.840
point she goes up against Butterball, but instead of making

1157
01:01:57.960 --> 01:02:02.480
him disappear, the house falls down on him. The structure,

1158
01:02:02.960 --> 01:02:05.400
the falling debris falls on top of him, and I'm like,

1159
01:02:06.000 --> 01:02:09.519
that's it. She never actually vanquishes him and sends him

1160
01:02:09.559 --> 01:02:11.840
back to the hellish realm. So I was like, does

1161
01:02:11.920 --> 01:02:14.639
that correct Bill? Did I see that correctly? Yeah?

1162
01:02:14.679 --> 01:02:17.199
I don't think that would really affect him. But I

1163
01:02:18.480 --> 01:02:21.320
think if they had more of a budget, we would

1164
01:02:21.360 --> 01:02:23.960
have saw that happen. I think they're like, all right,

1165
01:02:24.000 --> 01:02:27.480
he's indisposed, and probably when all the other ones disappeared,

1166
01:02:27.559 --> 01:02:28.639
he disappeared too.

1167
01:02:29.000 --> 01:02:31.480
Okay, Yeah, the ending is just a little rough because

1168
01:02:31.480 --> 01:02:34.480
then they find it's basically Kirsty and her boyfriend Steve too.

1169
01:02:34.679 --> 01:02:37.360
We haven't talked about at all here that's.

1170
01:02:37.199 --> 01:02:40.159
A known reason too. Yeah, if he wasn't in the movie,

1171
01:02:40.199 --> 01:02:42.679
what it made a difference? Not it does nothing, But

1172
01:02:42.760 --> 01:02:45.440
they escaped the house. As it's a very like Poltergeist

1173
01:02:45.559 --> 01:02:47.679
ending where we are to assume I guess the house

1174
01:02:47.800 --> 01:02:52.239
just burns to the ground. Then there's another character, this vagrant,

1175
01:02:52.320 --> 01:02:54.920
this homeless guy that appears throughout the movie that doesn't

1176
01:02:54.920 --> 01:02:58.719
make any sense either, appears at the end. Basically, Kirsty's

1177
01:02:58.719 --> 01:03:00.960
gonna let go of this Box's done with the puzzle box.

1178
01:03:00.960 --> 01:03:03.480
But this vagrant we saw earlier in the film shows

1179
01:03:03.519 --> 01:03:05.559
up at the end after the house is burnt to

1180
01:03:05.599 --> 01:03:08.639
the ground and is going to now take the puzzle

1181
01:03:08.679 --> 01:03:12.599
box for himself, when all of a sudden, he transforms

1182
01:03:12.639 --> 01:03:16.280
into this winged, skeletal creature and flies away with the

1183
01:03:16.280 --> 01:03:19.960
puzzle box. And I'm like, what the hell just happened?

1184
01:03:20.639 --> 01:03:23.119
But then I have to admit, there's like a good bookend.

1185
01:03:23.199 --> 01:03:26.599
We're back in Morocco with this merchant selling the box

1186
01:03:27.159 --> 01:03:30.239
once again, but to someone new. So I like that bookend,

1187
01:03:30.239 --> 01:03:32.280
But everything that led up to that and this ending

1188
01:03:32.280 --> 01:03:35.199
of this film was nonsense. Yeah. I love how Steve

1189
01:03:35.280 --> 01:03:38.239
wasn't fazed by the wiggle demon either just kind of like, oh,

1190
01:03:38.239 --> 01:03:39.519
there it goes just flying off.

1191
01:03:40.760 --> 01:03:42.760
That's a running thing. You nailed it, Bill, That's a

1192
01:03:42.840 --> 01:03:46.079
running through throughout the film. There's just some wild reactions

1193
01:03:46.119 --> 01:03:49.159
from characters like going, what, Yeah, how are you not

1194
01:03:49.440 --> 01:03:52.800
reacting to this? Or that just doesn't make any logical

1195
01:03:52.800 --> 01:03:55.320
sense you wouldn't react, or you overreact. I don't know.

1196
01:03:55.480 --> 01:03:58.480
It's very confusing. So those are some complaints.

1197
01:03:58.880 --> 01:04:01.519
I forgot how the movie and it because I'm thinking

1198
01:04:01.519 --> 01:04:04.800
to myself, you got to destroy the box, and then

1199
01:04:05.280 --> 01:04:08.119
when they're at the beach and they're burning it, I'm like, oh, okay,

1200
01:04:08.440 --> 01:04:10.840
she's trying to destroy it, so what the hell happens?

1201
01:04:10.880 --> 01:04:13.440
And then I forgot about the vagrant turning into a

1202
01:04:13.440 --> 01:04:17.519
winged demon flying off and like totally, oh all right,

1203
01:04:17.559 --> 01:04:20.199
that was kind of neat, but that was also really

1204
01:04:20.199 --> 01:04:20.800
fucking weird.

1205
01:04:21.079 --> 01:04:23.599
Yeah, just out of the blue. So is that where

1206
01:04:23.679 --> 01:04:25.960
they were at the beach with the box then with

1207
01:04:26.000 --> 01:04:29.320
those that's what I'm guessing. Okay, so the house didn't

1208
01:04:29.440 --> 01:04:30.960
well I mean the house.

1209
01:04:30.880 --> 01:04:33.440
Was destroyed though, right, I think so, yeah.

1210
01:04:33.239 --> 01:04:35.239
Because it was falling apart the whole time, So it's

1211
01:04:35.360 --> 01:04:40.440
just yeah, okay, all right, weird ending, but they didn't

1212
01:04:40.440 --> 01:04:41.760
have a lot of money to work with, so it

1213
01:04:41.920 --> 01:04:43.599
just kind of literally winged it.

1214
01:04:43.880 --> 01:04:44.719
Try to be forgiving.

1215
01:04:44.719 --> 01:04:45.760
What that's you're right? Right?

1216
01:04:46.280 --> 01:04:48.119
All right? I tried to go on to hey, it's

1217
01:04:48.159 --> 01:04:48.760
that actor.

1218
01:04:49.599 --> 01:04:50.039
Oh right.

1219
01:04:50.639 --> 01:04:53.400
So this segment we spotlight a character actor you have

1220
01:04:53.480 --> 01:04:56.159
seen in many other films, an actor making their big

1221
01:04:56.199 --> 01:04:59.280
screen debut, or an actor that makes an uncredited cameo.

1222
01:05:00.159 --> 01:05:02.760
Is that actor? Who do we choose this week? Jason?

1223
01:05:02.880 --> 01:05:05.320
Because I think there's like ten people in this movie.

1224
01:05:05.599 --> 01:05:07.239
Yeah, this was a little bit of a tough one.

1225
01:05:07.920 --> 01:05:12.440
So we'd like to choose an actor that we deem familiar,

1226
01:05:13.000 --> 01:05:14.760
but we just can't quite play them, or we don't

1227
01:05:14.840 --> 01:05:17.320
they're not a household name. So I decided to go

1228
01:05:17.400 --> 01:05:22.639
with one of our lead actors, Andrew Robinson, who portrays

1229
01:05:22.840 --> 01:05:28.360
Larry Cotton, Kirsty's father, Frank Cotton's brother, Julia's husband, Andrew Robinson.

1230
01:05:28.800 --> 01:05:32.400
He is an American actor from New York City. Throughout

1231
01:05:32.400 --> 01:05:36.280
the sixties and seventies, Robinson performed a wide variety of theater,

1232
01:05:36.360 --> 01:05:39.960
movie and television roles. These included the infamous scorpio killer

1233
01:05:40.960 --> 01:05:45.360
in Dirty Harry Way, back in seventy one. And then

1234
01:05:45.480 --> 01:05:47.719
this is funny on IMDb it says he did a

1235
01:05:47.760 --> 01:05:53.199
stint on Ryan's Hope, the soap opera show from nineteen

1236
01:05:53.239 --> 01:05:55.360
seventy five, but he actually did one hundred and sixty

1237
01:05:55.440 --> 01:05:58.320
nine episodes. I think that's a little more than a stint,

1238
01:05:58.519 --> 01:06:02.400
but that actually earned him an Emmy nomination. So there

1239
01:06:02.400 --> 01:06:05.079
you go. Moving on to his eighties snapshot if you will,

1240
01:06:05.679 --> 01:06:07.840
he does a bunch of TV episodes, everything from The

1241
01:06:07.880 --> 01:06:10.239
Dukes of Hazard to The eighteen to Cagney and Lacy

1242
01:06:10.239 --> 01:06:14.000
to Moonlighting. Between all of that, he was in the

1243
01:06:14.000 --> 01:06:17.960
film Mask from eighty five. He plays a detective named

1244
01:06:18.239 --> 01:06:22.119
Detective Monty from Cobra in eighty six. He's in This

1245
01:06:22.199 --> 01:06:25.519
hell Raiser in eighty seven. He's also in Shoot to

1246
01:06:25.599 --> 01:06:28.119
Kill in nineteen eighty eight, which we covered on this

1247
01:06:28.239 --> 01:06:31.599
very podcast, and I was like, ah, of course, that's

1248
01:06:31.639 --> 01:06:34.119
definitely something I recognize him from, because isn't he one

1249
01:06:34.159 --> 01:06:36.960
of the group of like hikers that goes with that

1250
01:06:37.079 --> 01:06:41.679
Clancy Brown joins up with and yeah. He also then

1251
01:06:41.840 --> 01:06:44.800
goes on to play Liberachi in the TV movie Liberachi

1252
01:06:44.840 --> 01:06:48.280
in nineteen eighty eight. After that, he was in Child's Play, three,

1253
01:06:48.400 --> 01:06:51.880
does a bunch more TV, and then he lands the

1254
01:06:52.000 --> 01:06:56.840
role of Elim Garak for thirty seven episodes of Star

1255
01:06:56.960 --> 01:07:00.800
Trek Deep Space nine, a show that you've become familiar

1256
01:07:00.840 --> 01:07:02.960
with just recently, Bill Bant.

1257
01:07:02.960 --> 01:07:06.039
I'm going back and watching that show. I missed it

1258
01:07:06.079 --> 01:07:08.519
the first time out, and he's been on it once

1259
01:07:08.559 --> 01:07:11.199
so far. Okay, so I still got what twenty twenty

1260
01:07:11.800 --> 01:07:15.679
nine more times to see him? Thirty six apparently, I guess.

1261
01:07:15.679 --> 01:07:17.239
Ok, I still have to see him thirty five.

1262
01:07:17.320 --> 01:07:19.159
Yeah, so he's gonna pop up thirty five more times

1263
01:07:19.280 --> 01:07:20.599
a million season one right now.

1264
01:07:20.960 --> 01:07:23.199
But I do recall him from the show. I was

1265
01:07:23.199 --> 01:07:25.360
a fan of Deep Space nine. He's great, and he

1266
01:07:25.480 --> 01:07:29.280
yes portrays Elan Garic, an exiled spy from the Cardassian

1267
01:07:29.400 --> 01:07:32.400
Union that was from nineteen ninety three to nineteen ninety nine.

1268
01:07:32.440 --> 01:07:35.360
He goes on to do more TV, primarily, and in

1269
01:07:35.440 --> 01:07:39.239
twenty twenty four loaned his voice to play Garak once

1270
01:07:39.280 --> 01:07:41.960
again in an episode of the animated series Star Trek.

1271
01:07:42.000 --> 01:07:46.239
Lower decks a little trivia. We know that you know?

1272
01:07:46.280 --> 01:07:49.280
He portrayed the Scorpio killer in Dirty Harry, which led

1273
01:07:49.280 --> 01:07:52.480
to him receiving serious death threats via telephone after the

1274
01:07:52.519 --> 01:07:56.519
film's release, which is crazy. He wrote a novel about

1275
01:07:56.559 --> 01:07:59.440
the star Trek Deep Space nine character he played, which

1276
01:07:59.480 --> 01:08:02.199
is entitled A Stitch in Time. You know, he almost

1277
01:08:02.239 --> 01:08:05.199
got the part of Odo on Deep Space nine after

1278
01:08:05.239 --> 01:08:07.480
reading for the part, but was chosen for the recurring

1279
01:08:07.559 --> 01:08:11.840
role of Garic instead. Pretty cool, Andrew Robinson or hey

1280
01:08:11.880 --> 01:08:12.960
it's that actor this week?

1281
01:08:13.199 --> 01:08:16.560
Yeah, I would say I probably know most from Jerdi Harry.

1282
01:08:16.600 --> 01:08:19.239
For sure, as soon as I saw those photos. Oh well, yep, yep,

1283
01:08:19.319 --> 01:08:21.600
of course. Yeah, he's the he's the main battie.

1284
01:08:21.840 --> 01:08:24.239
Time to move on to facts and trivia. What are

1285
01:08:24.239 --> 01:08:26.159
some facts in trivia we have about hell.

1286
01:08:26.119 --> 01:08:31.159
Raiser, the Chatterer, and Butterball. Cenobites had dialogue in the

1287
01:08:31.199 --> 01:08:35.840
original script, However, when their makeup made coherent speech impossible,

1288
01:08:35.880 --> 01:08:38.439
their lines were given to the female cenobyte and especially

1289
01:08:39.119 --> 01:08:42.439
the lead cenebite, Pinhead, which helped to cement his reputation

1290
01:08:42.640 --> 01:08:45.159
as the film's trademark character.

1291
01:08:45.760 --> 01:08:49.399
Yeah, so I think in the book Pinhead is not

1292
01:08:49.760 --> 01:08:53.039
the lead character. He's also known as Priests. He's not

1293
01:08:53.079 --> 01:08:56.319
known as Pitthead. That was something the crew came up with,

1294
01:08:56.600 --> 01:08:59.239
so I didn't know this. So there was a sequel

1295
01:08:59.560 --> 01:09:03.520
to the book, and it was called The Scarlet Gospels,

1296
01:09:03.960 --> 01:09:07.840
and in that book, Clivee Barker kills off the Pinhead character,

1297
01:09:08.199 --> 01:09:11.399
which obviously does not happen in the movies because he's

1298
01:09:11.439 --> 01:09:14.680
in I think there's eleven movies, so he's in all those.

1299
01:09:15.039 --> 01:09:18.319
So surprised about that. I think Clyte Barker didn't like

1300
01:09:18.479 --> 01:09:21.520
the fact that Pinhead was called Pinhead and decided, you

1301
01:09:21.560 --> 01:09:23.399
know what, off of my books.

1302
01:09:25.359 --> 01:09:28.319
Yeah, yeah, this film takes a lot of liberties with

1303
01:09:28.439 --> 01:09:29.359
the actual novel.

1304
01:09:29.680 --> 01:09:30.119
Yeah.

1305
01:09:30.439 --> 01:09:34.159
Clivee Barker insisted that quote unquote, Pinhead's personality be more

1306
01:09:34.199 --> 01:09:39.560
evocative of Christopher Lee's portrayal of Count Dracula. Quote. Part

1307
01:09:39.560 --> 01:09:41.600
of the chill of Dracula surely lies in the fact

1308
01:09:41.600 --> 01:09:44.199
that he's very clearly and articulately aware of what he

1309
01:09:44.319 --> 01:09:47.479
is doing. You feel that this is a penetrating intelligence.

1310
01:09:47.479 --> 01:09:50.159
And I don't find dumb things terribly scary. I find

1311
01:09:50.199 --> 01:09:54.119
intelligence scary, particularly twisted intelligence. It's one of the reasons

1312
01:09:54.119 --> 01:09:56.800
why Hannibal Lecter is scary, isn't it. It's because you

1313
01:09:56.880 --> 01:09:59.479
always feel that he's going to be three jumps ahead

1314
01:09:59.520 --> 01:09:59.680
of you.

1315
01:10:00.079 --> 01:10:02.279
So, as we mentioned a bunch of times, the production

1316
01:10:02.359 --> 01:10:05.039
basically had no budget and director Clive Barker had to

1317
01:10:05.079 --> 01:10:08.239
find creative methods of dealing with issues. Shooting in a

1318
01:10:08.279 --> 01:10:11.760
house with only a single camera to spare, Barker was

1319
01:10:11.800 --> 01:10:14.640
forced to rely on overhead and zoom shots due to

1320
01:10:14.760 --> 01:10:18.760
shooting and straints in limited areas to move in. So

1321
01:10:18.960 --> 01:10:21.359
the house was an actual house that they were shooting inside.

1322
01:10:21.600 --> 01:10:23.399
The only time I think they were on stage was

1323
01:10:23.479 --> 01:10:27.279
for the attic room. So several of the effects, including

1324
01:10:27.359 --> 01:10:31.039
Larry's blood being sucked into the floor in Frank's rebirth,

1325
01:10:31.560 --> 01:10:36.279
were either reshot due to looking unconvincing, or required additional

1326
01:10:36.279 --> 01:10:40.520
funding from New World Pictures to complete because of cost overruns.

1327
01:10:40.680 --> 01:10:43.840
Barker himself has said that the dodgy nature of the

1328
01:10:44.000 --> 01:10:46.920
FX can be traced to him completing the majority of

1329
01:10:46.960 --> 01:10:50.079
the work over a single weekend while getting drunk with

1330
01:10:50.119 --> 01:10:53.880
a Greek animator after filming rafts. So at the end,

1331
01:10:53.920 --> 01:10:58.680
when all the citabites are disappearing with that yellow, that's

1332
01:10:58.960 --> 01:11:03.359
Clive Barker and I guess animator were literally drawing on

1333
01:11:03.439 --> 01:11:04.800
the cells to make that happen.

1334
01:11:05.520 --> 01:11:07.840
That's great, and that just led into my I have

1335
01:11:07.920 --> 01:11:10.520
the same trivia here, and it was just Barker had

1336
01:11:10.520 --> 01:11:13.520
commented that he thinks the FX turned out pretty well

1337
01:11:13.640 --> 01:11:16.159
considering the amount of alcohol the too consumed that weekend

1338
01:11:16.359 --> 01:11:19.600
while working. YEP, I love this little bit. When Clive

1339
01:11:19.640 --> 01:11:22.600
Barker first showed the film to his mother, she cried

1340
01:11:22.640 --> 01:11:25.439
tears of joy upon seeing her son's name in the

1341
01:11:25.479 --> 01:11:29.279
opening credits. He leaned over and whispered that that would

1342
01:11:29.319 --> 01:11:31.640
be the happiest she would be for the next two hours.

1343
01:11:32.119 --> 01:11:34.199
Yeah, it'd be interesting to hear what her take was.

1344
01:11:34.840 --> 01:11:37.840
Actor was all said and done. I mean, no matter what,

1345
01:11:37.960 --> 01:11:40.399
she's proud that her son made the movie. But what

1346
01:11:40.439 --> 01:11:41.159
the hell is this?

1347
01:11:41.840 --> 01:11:45.600
So? The concept of a cube being used as a

1348
01:11:45.640 --> 01:11:48.840
portal to hell has its basis in the urban legend

1349
01:11:48.920 --> 01:11:53.640
of the Devil's Toy Box, which concerns a six sided

1350
01:11:53.800 --> 01:11:58.439
cube constructed of inward facing mirrors. According to legend, individuals

1351
01:11:58.479 --> 01:12:02.159
who enter the structure and then close it will undergo surreal,

1352
01:12:02.199 --> 01:12:06.319
disturbing phenomenon that will simultaneously grant them a revelatory experience

1353
01:12:06.640 --> 01:12:10.359
and permanently warp their mind. This is crazy built the

1354
01:12:10.399 --> 01:12:14.159
Devil's Toy Box most commonly refers to an urban legend

1355
01:12:14.479 --> 01:12:17.199
about a room with mirrored walls, floors, and ceiling that

1356
01:12:17.279 --> 01:12:19.680
is said to drive people to madness and is sometimes

1357
01:12:19.760 --> 01:12:22.279
linked to the Hell Raiser movies. It is also the

1358
01:12:22.279 --> 01:12:24.720
title of a twenty seventeen horror movie in a nonfiction

1359
01:12:24.800 --> 01:12:28.800
book about Prometheus technology threats, and has appeared in other media.

1360
01:12:29.000 --> 01:12:32.279
But the urban legend originated in northern Louisiana, where a

1361
01:12:32.319 --> 01:12:37.000
real life Halloween attraction with this name, The Devil's Toy Box,

1362
01:12:37.079 --> 01:12:40.760
was reportedly shut down after only a week due to

1363
01:12:40.840 --> 01:12:44.279
the severe reactions of people who entered. Here's the incident.

1364
01:12:44.279 --> 01:12:46.880
The attraction was shut down by the city council after

1365
01:12:47.079 --> 01:12:51.239
just one week because visitors experienced extreme reactions, including one

1366
01:12:51.279 --> 01:12:54.199
man who lasted four minutes and thirty seven seconds before

1367
01:12:54.520 --> 01:12:58.359
becoming mute and wide eyed, and another woman who had

1368
01:12:58.399 --> 01:13:02.000
a heart attack. Jesus, I just had to conclude that

1369
01:13:02.159 --> 01:13:04.720
it's a little bit of a tangent, but that's wild man,

1370
01:13:04.760 --> 01:13:07.920
because just this is all in free where this idea

1371
01:13:08.000 --> 01:13:10.960
of like a box that unleash's hell comes from and

1372
01:13:11.039 --> 01:13:15.359
has now been associated with Hell Raiser. The Devil's Toy Box.

1373
01:13:15.439 --> 01:13:18.239
And if we mentioned that the puzzle box itself is

1374
01:13:18.319 --> 01:13:21.600
known as the Lament configuration. I never knew that going

1375
01:13:21.600 --> 01:13:23.920
into this. I just always thought it was a puzzle box.

1376
01:13:23.960 --> 01:13:25.680
I don't even know if they mentioned that in any

1377
01:13:25.680 --> 01:13:26.359
of the other movies.

1378
01:13:26.760 --> 01:13:29.960
That's how I came about the Devil's Toy Box. Information

1379
01:13:30.199 --> 01:13:32.560
was looking up the box and you go to the

1380
01:13:32.560 --> 01:13:36.159
hell Raiser fandom wiki and it starts giving you all

1381
01:13:36.159 --> 01:13:39.680
this background lore and stuff, and I'm like, whoa, this

1382
01:13:39.720 --> 01:13:40.880
is some crazy stuff.

1383
01:13:41.479 --> 01:13:44.600
This I found funny. So Pinhead, who was played by

1384
01:13:44.640 --> 01:13:47.760
Doug Bradley, he was actually given a choice when filming

1385
01:13:47.800 --> 01:13:52.720
to either play the Cinnabyte or a mover, and Bradley

1386
01:13:52.840 --> 01:13:56.560
considered doing the mover part because he wouldn't have makeup

1387
01:13:56.600 --> 01:13:59.079
and people would actually see him. I think he made

1388
01:13:59.119 --> 01:14:00.640
the right choice. YEP.

1389
01:14:01.319 --> 01:14:03.840
I had mentioned it was off putting in the beginning

1390
01:14:03.840 --> 01:14:06.520
of this film when we see the actor portraying Frank

1391
01:14:06.560 --> 01:14:10.079
Cotton because his dialogue was dubbed. It was entirely dubbed

1392
01:14:10.079 --> 01:14:13.800
by actor Bob Sessions, and Sessions would later appear in

1393
01:14:13.880 --> 01:14:17.600
Barker's Night Breed in a supporting role. But one last

1394
01:14:17.840 --> 01:14:20.560
little bit too, which I thought was interesting character actor

1395
01:14:20.840 --> 01:14:24.039
one of our favorites, Bill Bank. Lance Hendrickson was offered

1396
01:14:24.079 --> 01:14:26.279
the role of Frank Cotton by New World Pictures, but

1397
01:14:26.319 --> 01:14:28.720
he turned it down, fearing that if successful, he would

1398
01:14:28.720 --> 01:14:30.840
have to appear in a series of sequels, which he

1399
01:14:30.880 --> 01:14:33.920
wasn't keen on. But Lance Henrickson would later go on

1400
01:14:34.000 --> 01:14:36.159
to appear in one of the Hell Raiser sequels, Hell

1401
01:14:36.279 --> 01:14:38.560
Raiser Hell World in two thousand and five.

1402
01:14:38.920 --> 01:14:40.000
I haven't seen that one.

1403
01:14:40.359 --> 01:14:41.479
No, I missed that one.

1404
01:14:41.640 --> 01:14:44.720
All right, Jason, we got some additional titles, Yes, diginal

1405
01:14:44.800 --> 01:14:49.159
titles for Hell Raiser. All right, here we go. Croatia

1406
01:14:49.960 --> 01:14:55.439
Lords of Hell, France and Uruguay the Pact in India

1407
01:14:55.840 --> 01:15:00.359
Son of the Devil, Mexico Door to Hell, Portugal is

1408
01:15:00.439 --> 01:15:06.000
Cursed Fire, Serbia was Lord of Hell. Taiwan is raised

1409
01:15:06.000 --> 01:15:12.239
Ghosts and eat People. Argentina was Hell Raiser, the Pact.

1410
01:15:12.520 --> 01:15:17.560
Brazil was Hell Raiser, Reborn from Hell. Germany was Hell Raiser,

1411
01:15:17.680 --> 01:15:21.680
The Gate to Hell, Italy Hell Raiser. There are no

1412
01:15:21.840 --> 01:15:27.720
limits Netherlands. Hell Raiser won the original. Okay, I guess

1413
01:15:27.760 --> 01:15:29.560
they knew there was going to be a sequel, right

1414
01:15:30.279 --> 01:15:37.399
Poland Hell Raiser Hell's Messenger and Spain Hell Raiser, those

1415
01:15:37.439 --> 01:15:38.359
who bring hell.

1416
01:15:38.960 --> 01:15:40.159
Okay, that's a lot.

1417
01:15:40.600 --> 01:15:41.640
Yeah, I appreciate.

1418
01:15:41.680 --> 01:15:44.760
I always appreciate these, But yeah I have I think

1419
01:15:44.760 --> 01:15:47.079
I still gotta go with what is it raise ghosts

1420
01:15:47.119 --> 01:15:48.239
and Eat People.

1421
01:15:48.159 --> 01:15:49.279
Eat People from Taiwan?

1422
01:15:49.399 --> 01:15:52.199
Yes, I just like the ones that are so random

1423
01:15:52.239 --> 01:15:53.880
and have nothing to like. What was the there was

1424
01:15:53.880 --> 01:15:57.319
something like create fire something? What was the cursed fire?

1425
01:15:57.439 --> 01:15:58.079
Cursed fire?

1426
01:15:58.520 --> 01:16:00.439
Yes, okay fire.

1427
01:16:00.960 --> 01:16:02.880
Yeah, Well, I'm going to add on a little bit

1428
01:16:02.960 --> 01:16:06.520
because you're talking about alternate titles. The film was originally

1429
01:16:06.560 --> 01:16:08.399
supposed to be called The hell Bound Heart, after the

1430
01:16:08.439 --> 01:16:11.399
novels upon which it was based, but the studio decided

1431
01:16:11.399 --> 01:16:13.279
the title sounded too much like a romance and asked

1432
01:16:13.319 --> 01:16:16.720
Clive Barker to change it. Barker offered the title Sato

1433
01:16:16.760 --> 01:16:20.399
Masochists from Beyond the Grave, which was rejected for the

1434
01:16:20.439 --> 01:16:23.840
overtly as sexual content. He ultimately opened the floor to

1435
01:16:23.880 --> 01:16:26.800
the production team to offer up their own suggestions, prompting

1436
01:16:26.840 --> 01:16:29.600
a sixty year old female crew member to offer up

1437
01:16:29.600 --> 01:16:32.680
the title what a Woman Will Do for a good fuck.

1438
01:16:33.159 --> 01:16:36.800
She's not lying, right, I mean that.

1439
01:16:36.720 --> 01:16:39.039
Would be a more appropriate title for this film than

1440
01:16:39.399 --> 01:16:40.079
Cursed Fire.

1441
01:16:40.600 --> 01:16:43.159
Yeah, I think I would agree with that also, Okay,

1442
01:16:43.199 --> 01:16:46.359
move it on to box office. So Hell Razor was

1443
01:16:46.399 --> 01:16:50.159
released on September eighteenth, nineteen eighty seven, and one ninety

1444
01:16:50.159 --> 01:16:53.520
seven theaters, with an estimated buzzet of just one million dollars.

1445
01:16:53.600 --> 01:16:57.039
Hell Raiser pulled in fourteen point six million dollars domestically

1446
01:16:57.520 --> 01:17:02.079
and added another thirty million dollars internationally. The film debuted

1447
01:17:02.119 --> 01:17:04.840
number four in its opening weekend, behind the debuts of

1448
01:17:04.920 --> 01:17:08.920
Fatal Attraction, The Principal, and The Pickup Artist, but the

1449
01:17:08.960 --> 01:17:11.000
next week it would move up to number three and

1450
01:17:11.039 --> 01:17:13.600
would stay in the top ten for just another week,

1451
01:17:14.199 --> 01:17:17.279
and by the end of its run, Hellraiser ranked as

1452
01:17:17.319 --> 01:17:21.119
the sixty seventh highest grossing film of the year in

1453
01:17:21.199 --> 01:17:25.000
the US, just ahead of Superman four The Quest for Peace.

1454
01:17:25.920 --> 01:17:28.279
So moving on to reviews. When growing up in the eighties,

1455
01:17:28.319 --> 01:17:30.760
we would watch at the Movies with Gene Cisco and

1456
01:17:30.800 --> 01:17:33.600
Roger Ebert to hear their reviews and watch clips of

1457
01:17:33.680 --> 01:17:38.119
upcoming movies. Unfortunately, the movie was not reviewed on the show,

1458
01:17:38.479 --> 01:17:42.479
but I did find Roger Ebert review and was not kind.

1459
01:17:42.920 --> 01:17:46.239
He gave it half a star, stating there are no

1460
01:17:46.359 --> 01:17:50.079
surprises in Hell Raiser, only a dreary series of scenes

1461
01:17:50.079 --> 01:17:52.920
that repeat each other. What fun is it watching the

1462
01:17:52.960 --> 01:17:57.039
movie mark time until the characters discover the obvious? This

1463
01:17:57.119 --> 01:18:02.000
is a movie without wit, style or reason. Leonard Moulton

1464
01:18:02.600 --> 01:18:04.680
was a little bit kinder, giving it two and a

1465
01:18:04.720 --> 01:18:09.760
half out of four stars, stating grizzly but stylist directorial

1466
01:18:09.800 --> 01:18:14.960
debut by famed horror novelist Clive Barker ugly fun all

1467
01:18:15.000 --> 01:18:18.439
the way. Rotten Tomatoes gives it a Tomatometer score of

1468
01:18:18.439 --> 01:18:21.199
seventy one percent, with a Popcorn Meter score of seventy

1469
01:18:21.239 --> 01:18:25.159
three percent, and also has an IMDb rating of six

1470
01:18:25.279 --> 01:18:29.720
point seven. So it takes us to additional thoughts or questions,

1471
01:18:30.239 --> 01:18:33.399
or some additional thoughts or questions you have about Hell Raiser?

1472
01:18:33.880 --> 01:18:37.560
Well, an additional thought is that Ebert but a little

1473
01:18:37.640 --> 01:18:40.479
rough on the review there? Yeah, didn't think I thought

1474
01:18:40.520 --> 01:18:43.640
it was. Yeah, maybe this movie didn't have much reason,

1475
01:18:43.800 --> 01:18:47.560
but it certainly had style. What was he talking about?

1476
01:18:47.640 --> 01:18:50.920
I don't know anyway? Why did Kirsty exactly why did

1477
01:18:50.920 --> 01:18:53.199
she end up in the hospital after she ran out

1478
01:18:53.239 --> 01:18:54.960
of the house. Was it just exhaustion?

1479
01:18:55.359 --> 01:18:58.079
Yeah? I think so? Okay, but why the police have

1480
01:18:58.159 --> 01:19:01.319
to you know, I don't understand that. You know, I

1481
01:19:01.319 --> 01:19:05.600
found interesting watching this, like who really is the villain

1482
01:19:05.920 --> 01:19:06.640
in this movie?

1483
01:19:07.000 --> 01:19:07.359
Hmmm?

1484
01:19:07.640 --> 01:19:10.960
And Kingdom realize it really is Frank Cotton. Like the cinebytes,

1485
01:19:11.279 --> 01:19:14.119
they're bad, but they're not bad, if that makes sense.

1486
01:19:14.439 --> 01:19:16.720
That's yeah, you open the realm. We figure if you

1487
01:19:16.760 --> 01:19:18.880
want to come in, so right, you asked for it,

1488
01:19:18.920 --> 01:19:19.399
come on in.

1489
01:19:20.039 --> 01:19:22.880
I like that observation, just to think about that, because

1490
01:19:22.880 --> 01:19:25.239
it's just a cursory glance and you look at the

1491
01:19:25.319 --> 01:19:28.600
VHS box, you would just think, yeah, oh god, Centobyites bad.

1492
01:19:28.760 --> 01:19:33.520
They're they're the villains, and I mean that's just not

1493
01:19:33.760 --> 01:19:36.159
really the case. Like you said, they're just the wardens

1494
01:19:36.199 --> 01:19:39.760
for the Prison of Hell as described in the research.

1495
01:19:40.239 --> 01:19:43.800
That's all. They're just doing their job. So it's your choice.

1496
01:19:43.800 --> 01:19:46.119
Do you want to you want to enter? Do you

1497
01:19:46.159 --> 01:19:49.600
want to summon this world? As Pinhead would say, then

1498
01:19:49.640 --> 01:19:52.560
that's on you. And that is I mean there's a

1499
01:19:52.600 --> 01:19:56.079
real gross grosso factor with Frank Cotton in this. I

1500
01:19:56.119 --> 01:19:58.439
mean every time he says come to Daddy in this

1501
01:19:58.680 --> 01:20:01.800
you're just like, yeah, he's definitely the villain. So I

1502
01:20:01.840 --> 01:20:04.960
think it's a good call, Bill Sleeves. The only thing

1503
01:20:05.279 --> 01:20:07.239
I was just gonna ask, is hell Raiser to a

1504
01:20:07.279 --> 01:20:09.880
better movie? But you said your favorites hell Raiser three.

1505
01:20:10.560 --> 01:20:13.199
And I've caught bits and pieces of other sequels just

1506
01:20:13.239 --> 01:20:17.039
out of you know, my morbid curiosity, I suppose, or

1507
01:20:17.439 --> 01:20:19.159
just to see because I think the Centa bites are

1508
01:20:19.159 --> 01:20:21.520
really cool. I'm like, well, what are these storylines going

1509
01:20:21.600 --> 01:20:23.279
to be? And is there going to be any real

1510
01:20:24.039 --> 01:20:27.720
resolution to what happens with the puzzle box and or

1511
01:20:27.880 --> 01:20:29.880
this other realm. I didn't know if you had any

1512
01:20:29.880 --> 01:20:31.159
more thoughts on the sequels.

1513
01:20:31.560 --> 01:20:34.079
Well, I think last night when I was watching it again,

1514
01:20:34.560 --> 01:20:37.239
like I said, to be just kicks into another movie

1515
01:20:37.319 --> 01:20:41.600
and they went into Yeah it was hell Raiser judgment.

1516
01:20:41.920 --> 01:20:45.520
I don't know what number it is in the Spanish sequels,

1517
01:20:46.000 --> 01:20:49.359
and I'm watching the first ten minutes going wait did

1518
01:20:49.359 --> 01:20:51.560
this cut into the middle of the movie? Is this

1519
01:20:51.600 --> 01:20:53.880
really how the movie begins? I had no idea what

1520
01:20:53.920 --> 01:20:56.520
the hell was going on. It was bizarre.

1521
01:20:57.319 --> 01:20:57.560
Yeah.

1522
01:20:57.680 --> 01:21:00.159
I was like, you know what, I don't need to

1523
01:21:00.199 --> 01:21:02.159
watch this any further. I'm just gonna shut.

1524
01:21:02.039 --> 01:21:03.359
Off right now. There you go.

1525
01:21:03.479 --> 01:21:06.039
Yeah, I'm not even saying three is the best one.

1526
01:21:06.399 --> 01:21:08.760
I just watched it over and over against because of

1527
01:21:08.800 --> 01:21:11.399
who was Okay, not necessarily because it was a good movie.

1528
01:21:11.920 --> 01:21:14.960
That's how much my obsession was of Paula Marshall at

1529
01:21:15.000 --> 01:21:19.359
the time and understood Yeah, yeah, I uh now who

1530
01:21:19.399 --> 01:21:21.720
just happens to be in DS nine, So I watch

1531
01:21:21.800 --> 01:21:25.319
every that's Terry Ferrell man for an episode. Yeah, yeah,

1532
01:21:25.479 --> 01:21:28.159
I'm curious to go back to visit Hell Raiser two

1533
01:21:28.680 --> 01:21:31.520
Hell Bounds, just to wonder how much will come back

1534
01:21:31.560 --> 01:21:33.119
to me and if it is a little bit.

1535
01:21:33.039 --> 01:21:35.720
More polished or feels that it had, you know, a

1536
01:21:35.760 --> 01:21:38.520
little better a little bigger budget to work with on

1537
01:21:38.560 --> 01:21:40.880
that one, and the effects are maybe even better. I

1538
01:21:40.880 --> 01:21:41.439
don't see.

1539
01:21:42.319 --> 01:21:45.199
They turn it around really fast, so we'll see. So yeah,

1540
01:21:45.439 --> 01:21:47.199
I think I need to go at least back and

1541
01:21:47.239 --> 01:21:47.800
watch that.

1542
01:21:47.720 --> 01:21:52.199
One, and then the twenty twenty two remake I was

1543
01:21:52.239 --> 01:21:53.960
curious to see. I still haven't seen it though.

1544
01:21:54.039 --> 01:21:56.319
But I mean, anytime you read stuff online, I mean,

1545
01:21:56.359 --> 01:22:00.399
people crush all these they're just so disappointed that they

1546
01:22:00.800 --> 01:22:02.840
really screwed up this whole franchise.

1547
01:22:03.520 --> 01:22:03.920
Mm hmm.

1548
01:22:04.359 --> 01:22:06.439
But the fact they were still able to churn out

1549
01:22:06.479 --> 01:22:09.880
eleven now and I think that includes the remake That's nuts.

1550
01:22:09.920 --> 01:22:12.479
Yeah, that's a lot. I mean, that's wild, It's this

1551
01:22:12.520 --> 01:22:13.680
is a huge franchise.

1552
01:22:13.880 --> 01:22:16.079
But I think half of them were direct a video.

1553
01:22:16.840 --> 01:22:18.960
I think the question I really should ask you is,

1554
01:22:19.439 --> 01:22:21.560
if you were a cenobite, which one would you be?

1555
01:22:22.199 --> 01:22:25.560
Oh yeah, I gotta be Pinhead. Chatter is pretty cool,

1556
01:22:25.840 --> 01:22:28.119
Cheddar is pretty cool, can't be Butterball.

1557
01:22:28.359 --> 01:22:29.159
But I heard for the.

1558
01:22:29.119 --> 01:22:33.880
First one they had the poor actor I'm not sure

1559
01:22:33.880 --> 01:22:36.319
if the same one for was having a drooling problem

1560
01:22:36.359 --> 01:22:38.800
with that chatter thing in his mouth all the time.

1561
01:22:38.840 --> 01:22:40.560
So I'm like, ah, yeah, I don't think i'd want

1562
01:22:40.600 --> 01:22:42.159
to I want to be doing that.

1563
01:22:42.319 --> 01:22:44.680
Did they have to attend to him with one of

1564
01:22:44.680 --> 01:22:48.439
those dentists like suction things the whole time? Probably they

1565
01:22:48.439 --> 01:22:49.960
said they fix it. For the second one.

1566
01:22:50.800 --> 01:22:52.560
If I'm just standing on set and you're just like

1567
01:22:52.680 --> 01:22:55.199
seeing drool like pouring, now, no thing.

1568
01:22:55.239 --> 01:22:56.840
They probably were like, oh no, that's just part of

1569
01:22:56.840 --> 01:22:59.880
the effects. It looks great. Yeah, a lot of drooling.

1570
01:23:00.359 --> 01:23:02.680
Trying to move on to our ratings. So, on a

1571
01:23:02.760 --> 01:23:06.880
scale of one to five puzzle boxes, what would you

1572
01:23:06.960 --> 01:23:08.079
give hell Racer?

1573
01:23:08.439 --> 01:23:11.439
I'm given this three and a half puzzle Boxes, A

1574
01:23:11.520 --> 01:23:14.239
confident three and a half puzzle boxes, Bill ban because

1575
01:23:14.319 --> 01:23:18.880
considering that this was Barker's directorial debut, that it was

1576
01:23:18.920 --> 01:23:23.039
on a limited budget, that it spawned a lasting franchise,

1577
01:23:23.279 --> 01:23:27.880
pretty damn good. Thought. The performances were solid. Got we

1578
01:23:27.880 --> 01:23:30.720
should have done this probably in trivia, But shout out

1579
01:23:30.720 --> 01:23:34.680
to Bob Keene who was in charge of the makeup,

1580
01:23:34.720 --> 01:23:38.560
effects and such, because the makeup, the effects, costume design.

1581
01:23:38.720 --> 01:23:41.079
Predit to all of those that put work into that,

1582
01:23:41.119 --> 01:23:44.399
because they're all great. Some of those effects and sequences

1583
01:23:44.399 --> 01:23:47.039
are just really wild and disturbing stuff I just had

1584
01:23:47.079 --> 01:23:48.960
never seen before in my life, especially now when I

1585
01:23:49.039 --> 01:23:52.760
was a kid. The cenobytes hold up for me. But yeah, overall,

1586
01:23:52.760 --> 01:23:55.520
the selling point is the mind of Clive Barker. It's

1587
01:23:55.520 --> 01:23:59.359
this freaky world. It only asks questions and sparks curiosity

1588
01:23:59.359 --> 01:24:04.800
into the cult or like you said, obsession. This sato masochism,

1589
01:24:05.279 --> 01:24:09.720
the sexual aspect of it. There's a real abyss to

1590
01:24:09.760 --> 01:24:11.960
this that you can kind of fall into. And what

1591
01:24:12.119 --> 01:24:15.239
is hell? What our taps into our deepest, darkest, most

1592
01:24:15.359 --> 01:24:19.199
visceral desires and secrets of the flesh. Barker's got a

1593
01:24:19.199 --> 01:24:22.880
hell of an imagination and an ingenuity behind his ideas

1594
01:24:22.920 --> 01:24:25.159
that can take hold of your mind and take you

1595
01:24:25.199 --> 01:24:28.520
to some dark places. So it's impressed and impactful for me.

1596
01:24:28.600 --> 01:24:32.079
So this one still has an effect for sure. So

1597
01:24:32.119 --> 01:24:33.960
I give it three and a half puzzle boxes.

1598
01:24:35.319 --> 01:24:40.479
Yeah, I'm giving it three myself. The effects would be

1599
01:24:41.720 --> 01:24:47.119
number one. The mythology number two. Music number three, that'd

1600
01:24:47.159 --> 01:24:50.079
be my pros. My big con is Claire Higgins as

1601
01:24:50.319 --> 01:24:54.800
Julia Cotton. I just don't find her believable as Larry's wife,

1602
01:24:55.039 --> 01:24:59.359
and that causes some issues. And then just the ending itself,

1603
01:24:59.560 --> 01:25:02.920
it just kind of just becomes like a monster chase.

1604
01:25:03.840 --> 01:25:06.000
It kind of gets away from the whole mythology. So

1605
01:25:06.319 --> 01:25:09.880
a little bit disappointing, and the fact that, like I said, overall,

1606
01:25:09.920 --> 01:25:13.560
it's just disgusting. Like I said, you do not want

1607
01:25:13.600 --> 01:25:16.600
to eat anything while you're watching this movie. And shout

1608
01:25:16.600 --> 01:25:19.560
out to Ashley Lawrence for her film debut. She did

1609
01:25:19.600 --> 01:25:22.199
a pretty good job with this also. And of course

1610
01:25:22.239 --> 01:25:25.760
Douc Bradley is Pinhead or leads Cinnabite or in the

1611
01:25:25.760 --> 01:25:28.960
book it's priest agreed. Yeah, I would, yeah, I would

1612
01:25:29.000 --> 01:25:31.359
certainly recommend it. And if you look at it online,

1613
01:25:31.600 --> 01:25:34.000
maybe watch the second one and then after that just

1614
01:25:34.439 --> 01:25:37.159
pretend the other ones never happened. Maybe I don't know.

1615
01:25:37.159 --> 01:25:39.239
I think I've heard some decent things about the remake,

1616
01:25:39.279 --> 01:25:41.279
but I'll have to check that one out myself. Okay,

1617
01:25:41.359 --> 01:25:43.399
So that about wraps it up for this week's episode.

1618
01:25:43.640 --> 01:25:46.359
As always, we appreciate you tuning in. Don't forget the

1619
01:25:46.359 --> 01:25:49.119
balls on your favorite streaming platform, leave it rating, and

1620
01:25:49.239 --> 01:25:52.640
drop us a review, hopefully a positive one. Want to

1621
01:25:52.640 --> 01:25:55.199
know more about the show, of course you do. Head

1622
01:25:55.239 --> 01:25:58.960
over to All Insmovies podcast dot com.

1623
01:25:58.199 --> 01:25:59.560
All the latest details.

1624
01:26:00.039 --> 01:26:02.359
We help join us next time as we dive into

1625
01:26:02.479 --> 01:26:07.000
another classic from the greatest movie decade ever teen eighties.

1626
01:26:07.439 --> 01:26:10.520
Until then, stay cool, stay retro, and have an excellent

1627
01:26:10.600 --> 01:26:11.159
day everyone.

1628
01:26:12.159 --> 01:26:16.680
Oh no tears please, it's a waste of good suffering.

1629
01:26:18.000 --> 01:26:36.880
Thanks for staying up with us. Good night world, for

1630
01:26:37.039 --> 01:26:40.920
secret alliances and murderous seductions have been made, which will

1631
01:26:40.960 --> 01:26:44.399
permit My god, I hate the way this is written.